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Music.

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Hello, and welcome to another episode of the Self-Initiative Project Podcast.

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I’m your host, Jim O’Brien. Hello, and welcome to episode 27.

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Today, we have on my good friend, Beverly Baker, with the Metropolitan Finishing

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School out in California. How are you, Beverly?

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Hi, I’m doing well. I’m doing really great. Good. It’s right the summer heat

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that’s starting to roll in, but otherwise doing good.

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And do you guys have the humidity out there that we do here in Georgia?

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I am in Los Angeles. It gets humid, but I definitely lived in more humid places.

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So this, I will take it. I, you know, it’s technically a desert,

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so I prefer it. Yeah, you guys have… Over the humidity, I feel for you.

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I guess you guys have more smog than the humidity.

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We do. We definitely do. Of course, right now, as we’re recording this,

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we’re in the middle of COVID shutdown.

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So everyone’s talking about how clear the air quality is. Although,

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I don’t know. I’ve been on some hikes.

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I’m like, that looks just like any other day to me.

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So, yeah. I don’t know. We’ll see.

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I know yesterday, I’m totally going off course. There was a fire in the brush

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a couple of miles from my house.

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And there was literally ash falling from the sky. I woke up smelling something burning.

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Something’s on fire. And then when I saw ash, I was like, oh,

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my God. We need to evacuate on top of everything else happening. Snowing in L.A.

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Yeah. Has most of the stuff settled down for the most part, or is it still going strong?

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What’s the climate like out there right now?

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Are you talking about with the protests and such?

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Yeah. Yeah. It’s actually, gosh, I completely have lost track of time.

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The first week, I think the first couple of days of the first week,

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things were really dicey and protests were happening that were peaceful.

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But then there were people taking advantage of the situation. We had a lot of fires.

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We had looting that was happening, as I saw in other parts of the country as well.

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But then from about the last 10 days or so on, the protests have been peaceful.

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And I think that people are doing a really good job of policing themselves.

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I was at a protest myself where a young man was doing, you know,

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just random graffiti tagging, not even in like support of the cause,

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but just out there tagging.

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And the group themselves were like, hey, dude, that’s not cool. Knock it off. And he did.

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So I think people are really serious about, you know, the message and want to

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make sure that it’s not not given a bad name. So I knock on wood,

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you never know how things are going to go.

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But I think hopefully we’re focused, people are focused more on the message.

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And there’s a lot more protests I’m seeing planned that are coming up.

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June is, I believe, related to gay pride.

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And so there’s a lot of, you know, not just Black Lives Matter,

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but, you know, the vulnerabilities of the gay black population as well.

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People are focusing on. Yeah. So it’s.

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It’s the world we’re in. Yeah, absolutely. So we’re here today to talk about

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you and your business and what you’re doing and Asphalt Anthropology and Metropolitan

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Finishing School and how that all came about.

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And then talk about some things as far as, you know,

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people, maybe women specifically, getting more interested in their personal

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safety and what they can do to do that and what we can do in the self-defense

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community to help them along in that journey.

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But before we get started, I always like to have my guests talk about themselves.

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I think sometimes that makes folks uncomfortable. I know it does me.

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But, you know, just tell us a little bit about yourself, your background,

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your history, how you got into this and what you’re doing.

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Yeah. So how I got into all this, I guess like a lot of people,

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you can kind of point back to when I got started in martial arts in high school.

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And it’s 30 something years ago now. I can’t believe it. Right.

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Time flies. But before martial arts, I’d always been involved in some kind of sport.

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I did gymnastics, ran track, did softball, played lacrosse, field hockey.

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I was always into something. I just loved moving.

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I wouldn’t call myself an athlete. I’d always make the team,

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but I was never the star athlete.

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That’s something that I always emphasize with people when I do the physical

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stuff. It’s like, I’ve just been doing this a long time, but inside,

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I feel like the biggest klutz. Like, I am not.

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Like, when people use the word athlete, I’m like, yeah, I’m just like,

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now I’m just like this frumpy middle-aged lady.

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But for me, I’ve always just loved martial arts, or just loved sport and moving my body.

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I got kind of hooked on martial arts in the most weird way possible,

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which was I had two older brothers who would watch those cheesy kung fu 70s

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movies where, like, the words wouldn’t match up. Love it.

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And, and so, you know, I also kind of grew up in a, in a pretty rough neighborhood,

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like in a working class, like row houses.

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And then at the end of the block were, were projects.

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And so, you know, my immediate neighborhood was kind of safe,

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but then like you kind of step out of that or you go to the bus stop, go to school.

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There was definitely some violence to mitigate as a kid. So I think that’s one

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reason I got drawn to the martial arts.

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One, because it’s beautiful, but I saw it as a way to kind of,

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you know, for protection.

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So, you know, I started that path, started doing taekwondo, stuck around like

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the Asian martial arts for a while, experimented with a lot of different things.

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Wound up getting my second don in a system called Cheyenne Roo,

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which is a combination of taekwondo, karate, aikido, kung fu, and jujitsu. two.

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I was there about 12 years, had a great experience with the people.

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And then I just kind of wanted to move on and try some other things.

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So I spent about 12 years combined vacillating between Krav Maga and boxing.

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So I spent about 10 or so years doing that.

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And then the last two to three years, I’ve been doing judo, which I wish I started

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when I was younger because it is my 49-year-old body feels every bit of it. Hitting those mats.

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Yeah, yeah, exactly. And I’ve competed throughout kind of my martial arts career.

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That hasn’t been a focus, but with judo, I’ve been doing more of it.

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And I have to tell you, and we’ll probably get into this in a little bit,

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but I’ve learned so much about self-defense and what for me,

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like for someone like me at my age or, you know, different people’s age and

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physical ability, it’s like nobody wants to go crash into those mats.

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I was competing against women half my age.

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And I was doing okay, but it just nearly physically broke me. And I was like,

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all of that like informed like what I’m teaching now and how I’m teaching because

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I feel like that’s just not realistic for the average, average person. Yeah.

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But yeah, but, but how I got into self-defense specifically was through my,

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through my martial arts training, it was kind of like, I think a natural progression,

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even though it wasn’t really on my radar, I didn’t plan on doing it.

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Honestly, I kind of got guilted into it by my instructors to teach self-defense.

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I think it was something because, Because, oh, there’s a woman.

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She has the passion for hitting things. She has fun. She has the ability.

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Go be a teacher. And I was like, okay.

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I didn’t have the internal drive to do it, to be honest with you. Sure.

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But I did it because in the Asian arts, it’s like, oh, there’s this ethos of giving back.

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So I did. I did my duty. And I really wound up really being very passionate

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about it and just really caring very much about the people I worked with and

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trained with and just kind of seeing the light bulbs go off for them.

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So it was never anything like I just kind of got into all this very selfishly

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and out of sport and out of fun and really enjoying it. But I wound up actually

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becoming the general manager of a martial arts school for about seven years.

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And from like a personal responsibility slash business point of view,

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even like I really built up the self-defense program there.

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And so I know you want to talk more and we’ll get into that.

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Just kind of like all the things I learned about how to get people in classes

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and what works, what doesn’t work.

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I’ve definitely been down that path. But ironically, I moved out of that role

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being the general manager of a martial arts school.

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And because I was inspired to go back to school and finish my undergraduate,

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undergraduate education.

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Yeah. When a young girl was murdered at a high school, her name was Artralla Mosley.

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And this was in Austin, Texas. This was back in 2003.

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Okay. And I took her murder very personally. She was murdered by her ex-boyfriend,

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just stabbed to death right there in the hall of school.

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And that was like a person or school that I’d never like gotten to connect with.

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I’m very active working with different schools and I just never got to connect with her.

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And, you know, clearly you can’t work with everybody.

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But in my ego mind, I just took it very personally that I never got to work

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with her. And so I took it upon myself.

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I joined the school district task force and my study violence in schools and

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like, what’s the outcome of, you know, all that’s going to be.

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And I remember putting together a proposal and working with other people to

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get support and my plan was I wanted to see self-defense curriculum,

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just some basics taught just as part of PE, right?

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Like you learn how to run, you learn how to dribble a ball, like let’s learn

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how to escape from a grab, let’s learn how to throw a punch,

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that kind of thing. Yeah.

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And got a lot of good support except from the man who was going to make that

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final decision. Right. Who is the superintendent.

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And his response to me was he didn’t want girls learning how to be violent.

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And the fact that a woman just got murdered, that pissed me off. Yeah, no doubt.

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So, yeah, that was a tough time just kind of going through all that,

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you know, wanting to be of service in that way and just having it not taken seriously.

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A lot of schools, I think, have come around since then. This was,

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again, back in 2003. But at the time it was pretty, I didn’t know of another district doing it.

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So, you know, that really changed the course of my life in that,

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you know, oh, here’s this PhD doctor and I’m going to beat him at his own game.

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If I need to affect social change, I’m going to go back and I’m going to finish

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my education and like, let’s let’s get it on.

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Like, let’s let’s do some social change here to get people some tools.

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Because I knew his answer was wrong. I just I felt inadequate to make the right argument. it.

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So since then, I’ve gone on, I’ve earned an MBA, master of business.

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So self-defense teaching is not my full-time job.

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I have a whole business career that I love and feel just really fulfilled in.

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But honestly, self-defense, it’s just something that won’t quit me.

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It’s just something that keeps circling back in my life. Even if I take a little

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break, it just, I don’t know, it just keeps coming back to be of service to

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my community in that way.

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So that’s my story and how we came together.

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I can relate. So I got a bunch of questions out of that and doing my brief preliminary

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research when I first reached out and, you know, I’ve been following you for

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a while on social media and whatnot.

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I think we talked about the first time I reached out to you,

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but you took some Krav. Are you taking out there in L.A.

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Or was this prior to you being in California?

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Like, what’s your Krav experience like? Do you like it? Do you think it’s effective?

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My background is partially in Krav, so that’s why I’m asking.

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Yeah, I’ve actually done it at a couple of different places.

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I started it in Austin, Texas at a really great facility there called Fit and Fearless.

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And so that’s who I started Krav with.

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They’re affiliated with Worldwide, which is based here in LA. Yes.

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And then when I came to LA, I moved out here about nine years ago.

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So I, I trained at worldwide, the middle west side school for a while,

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and then I live more east.

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So I wound up going to another school, which wasn’t as crazy about,

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so I won’t name check them. Yeah.

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But yeah, I mean, I think, you know, Krav in general, like, like any place you go to, it’s, it’s.

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There’s, you know, people ask me about, oh, what should I do?

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What should I train? It’s like, go find a really good teacher who knows what they’re doing.

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Like these labels and names of schools don’t mean anything because you may have

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a really good Krav instructor and a really bad Krav instructor and,

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or same thing for jujitsu or same thing for, you know, Kung Fu,

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like whatever you want to do, it really boils down to the instructor.

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So, you know, I’ve had both in Krav and then in other types of martial arts,

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you know, have had positive and negative experiences, you know,

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just kind of based on the attitude, based on their knowledge, based on their goals.

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And, you know, that’s something I think, you know, everybody has to take into

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consideration when you’re hunting around.

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And, you know, when people hunt around for a school, go take a trial lesson,

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go hang out there, sign up for three months, like go for it.

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And then like, I think a lot of people think that they go somewhere and then they have to stay.

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And, you know, of course I’m biased because as I’ve told you,

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my career is like, I’ve, I’ve been to a lot of different places and,

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you know, a lot of that is a function I’ve just moved or I’ve,

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it’s like, oh, I want to learn a new skill.

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Like I got into judo because I wanted to get better kind of the body weight stuff and infighting.

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I naturally I’m a striker. I love striking. It makes me happy.

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Yes. I had a great workout this morning.

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I got a new, new set of mitts and I’m like glowing.

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So you know judo is not necessarily my my my

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natural fit but you know personally it’s

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like i think there’s a lot of value in checking

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out different styles yep but of course somebody else

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is going to have different goals like if somebody else’s goals is just strictly

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to learn self-defense then probably hanging out in a judo club is is not the

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best bet but again it all comes down to i think you know the instructor for

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sure and what your goals are i noticed some of the certifications and things

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you’ve gone through, I noticed a couple that struck me.

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Tell me about your CERT experience. I did that here in my county where I reside as well.

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And I thought it was great. I got a lot out of it. What was it like for you?

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And where did you do it? Did you do that in LA or was it somewhere else?

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Yeah, no, it was here. So again, so CERT, I fell into by accident and by a mistake,

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everything I do, I’m like, oh, I just found it here.

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I had been looking to re-sign up for my Red Cross, get that certification all redone. Yeah.

00:15:16.403 –> 00:15:22.463
And just in Googling the place to do that, CERT popped up. So community emergency response team.

00:15:22.883 –> 00:15:27.983
And so, okay, I’m going to finish my Red Cross stuff and then let me check this thing out.

00:15:28.143 –> 00:15:32.663
And so CERT, I did it with my husband. It was a nine, I believe a nine week

00:15:32.663 –> 00:15:34.603
course that lasted three hours.

00:15:34.743 –> 00:15:40.023
And it was sponsored by three course put on by the Los Angeles Fire Department.

00:15:40.023 –> 00:15:43.103
Yeah and for nine weeks we go through

00:15:43.103 –> 00:15:45.983
different kinds of disasters and like what

00:15:45.983 –> 00:15:48.803
your response can be so of course here in

00:15:48.803 –> 00:15:51.983
la like i said like i woke up this morning the other day and it was like ash

00:15:51.983 –> 00:15:56.263
falling from the sky yeah other days it’s earthquakes some days it’s you know

00:15:56.263 –> 00:16:02.363
uprisings like you never know and so it really taught me a lot about like the

00:16:02.363 –> 00:16:07.343
physical like what a fire does or how an earthquake operates.

00:16:07.523 –> 00:16:08.703
So it gives you that knowledge.

00:16:08.943 –> 00:16:13.903
But I think even more importantly, it’s like, and this is what I teach in Metropolitan

00:16:13.903 –> 00:16:16.063
Finishing School, you’re in a city environment.

00:16:16.263 –> 00:16:18.803
Like what are the tools that are around you? What are the risks?

00:16:19.023 –> 00:16:19.903
What are the liabilities?

00:16:20.403 –> 00:16:25.243
So for example, when and if an earthquake hits, like I now have the tools and

00:16:25.243 –> 00:16:29.823
I know where to go in my home and in my neighbor’s home to turn off like the gas and the water.

00:16:30.183 –> 00:16:33.983
And I know that why that’s important. So I have those basic skills.

00:16:34.690 –> 00:16:40.550
But I think even more, and this is something I teach in Metropolitan Finishing

00:16:40.550 –> 00:16:43.670
School, in fact, I did a post about it this morning on Instagram,

00:16:43.930 –> 00:16:46.070
is we are our own first responders.

00:16:46.070 –> 00:16:51.990
You know, if, God forbid, the big, you know, earthquake hits or something happens,

00:16:52.530 –> 00:16:55.070
people aren’t going to just come running to my house on me.

00:16:55.210 –> 00:16:58.630
The fire department has many other priorities to do.

00:16:58.810 –> 00:17:01.850
And I am not one of them. Like, they’ve got their list.

00:17:02.110 –> 00:17:05.090
And insert, like, we talked about triage and we talked about,

00:17:05.190 –> 00:17:06.870
like, how they make those decisions.

00:17:07.470 –> 00:17:12.350
And so it was very eye-opening. It gave me, one, an appreciation for what they do.

00:17:12.350 –> 00:17:16.590
And it also, it’s like, okay, as a human being walking around on the face of

00:17:16.590 –> 00:17:21.610
this earth, like, what can I do to protect myself and my loved ones?

00:17:21.610 –> 00:17:24.370
And doing cert was just a natural fit.

00:17:24.470 –> 00:17:27.570
And I think it’s interesting because you asked, like, where I took it.

00:17:27.690 –> 00:17:31.810
And so, like, in L.A., it’s like, you know, of course, basic principles are going to be the same.

00:17:31.930 –> 00:17:34.950
Like, you know, don’t, you know, how do you store water, that kind of thing.

00:17:35.210 –> 00:17:40.310
But, you know, in L.A., it’s like, you know, we have a lot of crazy natural

00:17:40.310 –> 00:17:41.870
disasters that can happen.

00:17:42.110 –> 00:17:46.350
So it’s really kind of like, you know, I think really important.

00:17:46.690 –> 00:17:51.710
And I’ve loved encouraging friends and neighbors to go and take it. I do too.

00:18:13.508 –> 00:18:17.788
My county has an emergency management something something division.

00:18:18.128 –> 00:18:20.948
Anyway, they’re the ones who are responsible for putting it on here.

00:18:21.088 –> 00:18:26.428
And I took away a lot of information. As a matter of fact, it made me do some

00:18:26.428 –> 00:18:28.228
things that I hadn’t been doing.

00:18:28.368 –> 00:18:32.648
For example, having a couple more fire extinguishers throughout the house, right?

00:18:32.888 –> 00:18:36.628
Just some basic stuff like that. But I thought the knowledge was invaluable.

00:18:37.268 –> 00:18:41.408
And I think it’s great for anyone. And, you know, it’s free.

00:18:41.408 –> 00:18:45.868
There’s really not an excuse not to do it, especially if you think you should

00:18:45.868 –> 00:18:50.008
be in charge of your own personal safety, which I happen to. But it was great.

00:18:50.748 –> 00:18:56.068
For me, I think the biggest thing that I struggled with in class is the triage

00:18:56.068 –> 00:19:01.488
and mass casualties, you know, dealing with mass casualties and the fact that

00:19:01.488 –> 00:19:04.028
they don’t worry about CPR and anything like that.

00:19:04.168 –> 00:19:07.448
Like if that person’s in that state, leave them and go on to the next because

00:19:07.448 –> 00:19:10.928
it’s about the greater good for the masses, not the individuals.

00:19:10.928 –> 00:19:16.028
And I struggled with that because I’m certified in first aid and CPR and all that good stuff, too.

00:19:16.368 –> 00:19:20.628
So for me, it was like, wait a minute, I can’t I can’t work on this person here

00:19:20.628 –> 00:19:24.148
that might need it. I have to just move on. And so that was eye opening.

00:19:24.408 –> 00:19:29.088
So there was a lot of there was a lot of interesting points made in that course.

00:19:29.108 –> 00:19:31.548
And I think ours was eight or nine weeks as well.

00:19:31.788 –> 00:19:34.988
Every Tuesday night for two or three hours, something like that.

00:19:35.728 –> 00:19:39.688
So, yeah, I think it’s great. And it’s, if, if you have that program in your

00:19:39.688 –> 00:19:41.188
community, I highly recommend it.

00:19:41.848 –> 00:19:46.388
I hear you in the triage. Cause I, I distinctly remember we watched a video

00:19:46.388 –> 00:19:51.368
of an event and then it was like interactive where you had to like triage and

00:19:51.368 –> 00:19:52.468
say what you’re going to do.

00:19:52.608 –> 00:19:56.188
And that was really hard. And there was one where it was like a two year old

00:19:56.188 –> 00:20:00.168
baby and you had to like, be like, nope, the baby’s dead. And it was just like,

00:20:00.448 –> 00:20:05.548
oh, it was just like, that was such a, I mean, it’s a movie for heaven’s sake. I can’t even imagine.

00:20:06.208 –> 00:20:11.128
But just to kind of like come to that kind of decision tree of like,

00:20:11.488 –> 00:20:15.388
you got to pass over that two-year-old because they’re not going to make it.

00:20:15.848 –> 00:20:19.968
And then have you had the chance, Jim, to, in addition to follow up on the cert,

00:20:20.108 –> 00:20:23.628
like in our county, there’s like events throughout the year that you can go

00:20:23.628 –> 00:20:24.828
to where they host like…

00:20:26.318 –> 00:20:31.478
Like take shootings and stuff like that. Have you had the chance to do any of that? Yeah.

00:20:31.838 –> 00:20:34.898
So I don’t do it all the time, but I have taken it.

00:20:34.938 –> 00:20:38.138
I have taken advantage of a couple of volunteer opportunities.

00:20:38.138 –> 00:20:43.078
I guess for us here, when you get through the CERT program and you get your

00:20:43.078 –> 00:20:48.178
certification in CERT, you’re now on a volunteer list.

00:20:48.178 –> 00:20:50.578
And so you’re able to participate in some things.

00:20:50.698 –> 00:20:54.598
And so a couple of things that I was fortunate enough to participate in were

00:20:54.598 –> 00:20:56.578
active shooter, active killer.

00:20:57.318 –> 00:21:01.978
And so I’ve walked, I’ve had a lot of training around active shooting, killing,

00:21:02.178 –> 00:21:05.598
whatever, but a couple of the activities that we got to do, which was really

00:21:05.598 –> 00:21:10.218
cool was we shut down an entire local mall one early morning on the weekend

00:21:10.218 –> 00:21:12.758
and had an active shooter scenario there.

00:21:13.478 –> 00:21:15.838
I got to play a victim, you know, both.

00:21:17.278 –> 00:21:20.878
There’s been three times that I’ve done it. One was in mall and I was a victim.

00:21:21.138 –> 00:21:26.598
One was at a mass transit train, underground train station here in Atlanta.

00:21:26.598 –> 00:21:34.758
They shut it down and it was full force fire and LEO from multiple cities and counties came in live.

00:21:34.998 –> 00:21:40.218
Well, not live as in live bullets, but, you know, gunfire explosions going off,

00:21:40.398 –> 00:21:43.118
triage happening, getting carried out on gurneys.

00:21:43.358 –> 00:21:48.938
And then another time I got to do school shooting where I was just a standby,

00:21:48.958 –> 00:21:51.018
but they had to, you know, check me out.

00:21:51.138 –> 00:21:55.498
And I got the knee and the back of the neck and all of that treatment when they came through.

00:21:55.778 –> 00:22:00.138
So yeah, I’ve got to experience some of that stuff. And that’s also very valuable

00:22:00.138 –> 00:22:04.718
because now you got to see how it works from multiple angles and you know better

00:22:04.718 –> 00:22:06.498
what to do or what to be prepared for.

00:22:07.298 –> 00:22:11.818
Yeah. When I went to an event like that and they, for one of the drills,

00:22:11.998 –> 00:22:15.998
they put me in like the overseer of triage. I know I’m getting the terminology wrong.

00:22:16.918 –> 00:22:20.198
Like I’ve done the training and I go to like two or three refreshes a year,

00:22:20.298 –> 00:22:22.538
but like, it’s like, you kind of like, you can only do so much,

00:22:22.538 –> 00:22:26.578
but they, for one section, they put me in charge of triage and they did this

00:22:26.578 –> 00:22:28.078
thing where they gave me people.

00:22:28.518 –> 00:22:33.158
And then at some point they just sent in new people randomly and pulled out other people.

00:22:33.278 –> 00:22:36.718
Like they were doing it to like, you know, really be challenging.

00:22:36.938 –> 00:22:39.758
I was like, Oh my gosh. And so, you know, like I

00:22:39.758 –> 00:22:42.978
did it okay I was able to manage and get everyone triaged but

00:22:42.978 –> 00:22:46.038
it just was such a you know again you know

00:22:46.038 –> 00:22:48.778
that it’s not real but at the same time like if

00:22:48.778 –> 00:22:51.858
it is real like just all these moving parts to

00:22:51.858 –> 00:22:56.598
manage and again as a CERT member like they’re not you know LAFD is like so

00:22:56.598 –> 00:23:00.518
many pros they’re not going to like look me for it but again it’s kind of working

00:23:00.518 –> 00:23:04.658
that kind of executive functioning and and just gave me such an appreciation

00:23:04.658 –> 00:23:08.978
for what they do but yeah I mean like in the community where I live,

00:23:09.198 –> 00:23:12.218
like God forbid if my building falls down, you know.

00:23:13.438 –> 00:23:15.958
You’re suddenly in that situation. So it’s,

00:23:16.443 –> 00:23:19.123
Yeah. Incredibly valuable. I love that you asked me that question.

00:23:19.383 –> 00:23:23.103
No, I saw it and I was like, I’ve got to ask her about that because we’ve got

00:23:23.103 –> 00:23:25.023
that in common, too. And it’s great.

00:23:25.483 –> 00:23:31.243
And, you know, when it started here, it’s kind of evolved or whatever you want to say here in my county.

00:23:31.243 –> 00:23:38.143
But when it started, it was meant to arm some civilians so that they, if a disaster,

00:23:38.423 –> 00:23:42.503
mass scale disaster did strike, whatever that might be, that they could be called

00:23:42.503 –> 00:23:47.323
up to come in and support first responders should first responders be overwhelmed.

00:23:47.663 –> 00:23:53.103
And since then, due to politics or some things that past CERT members have tried

00:23:53.103 –> 00:23:56.703
to do, they’ve kind of scaled that back and said, look, we’re not looking to

00:23:56.703 –> 00:24:00.603
call you guys up necessarily, but here’s some information for you and your family.

00:24:00.603 –> 00:24:04.803
And I don’t think that’s a bad thing because I think more people should get

00:24:04.803 –> 00:24:09.643
this sort of information to protect just themselves and their family and their

00:24:09.643 –> 00:24:10.923
loved ones in their home, right?

00:24:11.003 –> 00:24:14.263
It’s not necessarily that you have to go out in the community and do stuff,

00:24:14.283 –> 00:24:18.823
but just being able to better look after your own, I think, is a good enough

00:24:18.823 –> 00:24:20.763
reason to look into that program. Yeah.

00:24:20.923 –> 00:24:24.343
I mean, if nothing else, I know how to, again, like shut off the electricity

00:24:24.343 –> 00:24:29.743
and the gas, all that stuff to my place, my native purse place,

00:24:29.803 –> 00:24:33.743
and then the high rise that’s next to me. So they don’t blow up and fall on me.

00:24:34.003 –> 00:24:37.283
And so, yeah, I’m not looking to be a hero.

00:24:37.823 –> 00:24:41.223
I am kind of a very selfish oriented person.

00:24:41.383 –> 00:24:46.203
It’s like, as long as me and mine are taken care of, I’ll start to look out

00:24:46.203 –> 00:24:48.123
beyond that. But yeah, I mean, that’s what I love.

00:24:48.263 –> 00:24:52.723
CERT is totally up your alley, you know, with the idea of that personal responsibility.

00:24:53.123 –> 00:24:57.863
So yeah, great program. And I will brag that LAFC, they tell us they’re the

00:24:57.863 –> 00:25:00.023
ones who started first CERT in the country.

00:25:00.363 –> 00:25:04.623
And then it was FEMA who came to them and modeled it nationally.

00:25:04.943 –> 00:25:07.623
And then it’s gone on to other places. Right on. Yeah.

00:25:08.023 –> 00:25:11.083
Our instructor is very proud. That’s awesome.

00:25:12.163 –> 00:25:15.523
And yeah. Yeah. I think it’s a great program. and we

00:25:15.523 –> 00:25:18.483
walked away with a very cool wrench to say to

00:25:18.483 –> 00:25:21.463
to turn off said gas so that’s a bonus too

00:25:21.463 –> 00:25:24.263
oh isn’t that the coolest i love it and

00:25:24.263 –> 00:25:27.143
a little hard hat and the best and yeah

00:25:27.143 –> 00:25:29.863
yeah the other thing i wanted to ask you about

00:25:29.863 –> 00:25:34.143
is this understanding violence from emory so i gathered that you were in atlanta

00:25:34.143 –> 00:25:38.063
in one point or was this an online thing because i think if it’s online i definitely

00:25:38.063 –> 00:25:44.343
want to do it it is online so you can do it um i i will say i i have a brother

00:25:44.343 –> 00:25:47.223
and sister-in-law in Atlanta, and shout out to them.

00:25:47.703 –> 00:25:52.943
But no, I did that online. That came to me by way of Randy King, who is just awesome.

00:25:53.343 –> 00:26:00.943
And it was a really great course in that it had a very kind of scholarly academic approach.

00:26:01.103 –> 00:26:04.323
And so it was a very kind of rational, cool look at violence.

00:26:04.623 –> 00:26:09.423
There’s some things that kind of like made my skin crawl, I’ll be honest with you.

00:26:10.123 –> 00:26:16.063
Like one instructor said something about yeah teaching women self-defense is victim blaming so like,

00:26:16.669 –> 00:26:20.169
I don’t have time for that. But overall, it was fantastic.

00:26:20.189 –> 00:26:25.049
And I really appreciated all the statistics and the data that they went into.

00:26:25.269 –> 00:26:30.149
And I really appreciated, I learned so much about how drugs and alcohol and

00:26:30.149 –> 00:26:35.229
the impact that it has on various types of crimes and various types of crime,

00:26:35.409 –> 00:26:37.949
both on stranger and then in the home.

00:26:38.209 –> 00:26:44.689
So really, that was incredibly valuable, I thought, to, you know, get real about the data.

00:26:44.889 –> 00:26:48.429
I think a lot of times in self-defense, we’re always like defending against

00:26:48.429 –> 00:26:52.509
the boogeyman and, you know, the guy jumping out from behind the bushes.

00:26:52.509 –> 00:26:56.869
But when you look at the data, like, you can like get pretty specific.

00:26:57.069 –> 00:26:59.809
Like violence has a pattern, like let’s decode it.

00:27:00.369 –> 00:27:03.309
And I’ve really, really appreciated that about that course.

00:27:03.929 –> 00:27:06.729
Sold. You’ve got me on board because I saw that and I was like,

00:27:06.809 –> 00:27:09.209
hmm, that’s right here. I’m going to have to check that one out.

00:27:09.329 –> 00:27:12.969
So that’s why I wanted to ask. Okay, so now the more obvious question,

00:27:13.229 –> 00:27:19.769
why Metropolitan Finishing School? How does that equate to self-defense and personal safety?

00:27:19.969 –> 00:27:21.989
What is going on there?

00:27:22.849 –> 00:27:26.609
Yeah. So Metropolitan Finishing School, it’s meant to be tongue in cheek.

00:27:26.829 –> 00:27:28.729
I’m kind of a sarcastic person.

00:27:29.069 –> 00:27:32.849
So we are not a finishing school in the sense about, you know,

00:27:33.009 –> 00:27:34.869
here’s how to sip tea with your pinky up.

00:27:35.049 –> 00:27:39.709
But it’s more about the skills of navigating public spaces, particularly urban

00:27:39.709 –> 00:27:43.269
spaces, but it can be any public space, how to do that with skills.

00:27:43.269 –> 00:27:47.509
So it’s like, what are the things that like, if you were dropped in a city,

00:27:47.809 –> 00:27:51.489
any city or maybe a specific city that you would need to know that you would

00:27:51.489 –> 00:27:55.809
need to know about how to read the environment, how to read the people, how to read the culture?

00:27:56.089 –> 00:27:59.589
Do you know how to read the graffiti? Do you know, like, if you see graffiti,

00:27:59.749 –> 00:28:01.709
do you know what that means? And so,

00:28:02.409 –> 00:28:05.809
It came about because kind of a couple of things.

00:28:05.869 –> 00:28:08.669
Again, I’d been teaching self-defense for a couple of decades,

00:28:08.909 –> 00:28:12.549
the kind of traditional, what I call mainstream, where it’s like you kick,

00:28:12.669 –> 00:28:16.929
you punch, you yell, you set boundaries, that kind of stuff was incredibly valuable.

00:28:17.329 –> 00:28:22.169
But I had kind of two awakenings here in the last couple of years for myself.

00:28:22.489 –> 00:28:25.229
One, just being in L.A., I’ve been here nine years.

00:28:25.969 –> 00:28:29.929
And just a very simple example, like mainstream self-defense will tell you that

00:28:29.929 –> 00:28:32.689
if you cross, if you see someone down the street that looks sketchy,

00:28:32.809 –> 00:28:36.109
then cross the street and get to keep going where you’re going. Sure.

00:28:36.409 –> 00:28:41.049
But the truth is in what’s happening in the communities here,

00:28:41.229 –> 00:28:44.469
if you saw somebody sketchy, you would never get to where you’re going because

00:28:44.469 –> 00:28:46.389
you’d be zigzagging across the street all day.

00:28:46.769 –> 00:28:52.369
And so it’s really about being more skilled than just crossing the street.

00:28:52.369 –> 00:28:56.449
It’s things like how to maybe use camouflage.

00:28:56.569 –> 00:28:58.909
It’s things about how to use your environment.

00:28:59.109 –> 00:29:01.769
So I’ve had folks who looked like a threat.

00:29:02.069 –> 00:29:06.389
I would either like blend into the crowd that was walking by or just stepping

00:29:06.389 –> 00:29:08.529
behind a pole while I wait for the light.

00:29:08.569 –> 00:29:13.809
And as soon as like they don’t see me, I’m no longer like the target of their attention.

00:29:14.129 –> 00:29:18.469
So it’s taking things to kind of a higher level of skill. Because,

00:29:18.609 –> 00:29:23.409
frankly, I don’t want to go rolling around on the streets with anybody here in LA.

00:29:23.609 –> 00:29:25.609
I don’t want to even touch them.

00:29:25.849 –> 00:29:30.189
So if I can employ some of these other kind of preemptive skills,

00:29:30.429 –> 00:29:33.929
that’s going to be like a much better win for me.

00:29:34.169 –> 00:29:40.349
Some of it also is de-escalation and even de-escalating of mentally ill folks.

00:29:40.569 –> 00:29:43.589
This is something I’ve not had any formal training in. Sure.

00:29:43.869 –> 00:29:48.349
But just by the seat of my pants, I’ve had to learn how to kind of someone was

00:29:48.349 –> 00:29:53.169
coming at me one time and just kind of put my hands up and he was yelling at

00:29:53.169 –> 00:29:55.369
me and there was really no place for me to go because of traffic.

00:29:55.649 –> 00:29:58.229
And I just put my hands up and I go, hey, man, we’re cool.

00:29:58.980 –> 00:30:02.180
And just that, like, it stunned him. Like, he didn’t know what to say to that,

00:30:02.300 –> 00:30:04.400
right? Right. Kind of talked to him like he was a normal person,

00:30:04.580 –> 00:30:05.660
but kind of set that boundary.

00:30:05.940 –> 00:30:08.600
Yeah. And looked back, he kind of just stopped in his tracks.

00:30:08.600 –> 00:30:11.620
And I just, like, hustled the heck out of there, just kept going down the street.

00:30:12.000 –> 00:30:14.920
And then, like, I got far enough away and I looked over my shoulder.

00:30:15.060 –> 00:30:17.220
He, like, bellowed at me, like, yelled something.

00:30:17.500 –> 00:30:23.180
But it’s, you know, it’s, I think, like, a higher level of skills that I’m wanting

00:30:23.180 –> 00:30:27.320
to share with people more than just don’t look at your phone.

00:30:27.320 –> 00:30:32.760
And here’s how to punch something because sometimes you need to look at your phone.

00:30:32.980 –> 00:30:35.640
So you’ll never hear from me like, don’t look at your phone,

00:30:35.740 –> 00:30:39.980
but I’ll be like, okay, if you need to look at your phone, what’s the best place to do that?

00:30:40.120 –> 00:30:44.320
Maybe it’s going up this super long escalator where nobody’s around and you

00:30:44.320 –> 00:30:46.380
have to text your friend and say, I’m lost.

00:30:46.640 –> 00:30:48.640
Can you meet me at the other entrance or something like that?

00:30:48.700 –> 00:30:53.740
It’s like, it’s about just kind of being in public space and using it smartly and wisely.

00:30:54.020 –> 00:30:58.340
So that’s, to me, it’s all about the finishing school aspect of it.

00:30:58.480 –> 00:31:02.200
It’s just how do you be in the city or just any public space?

00:31:02.220 –> 00:31:03.480
I don’t want to limit this.

00:31:04.240 –> 00:31:08.420
You may be in another town that’s not as dicey. You can still use the principal

00:31:08.420 –> 00:31:09.880
and you’re just not lucky you.

00:31:10.020 –> 00:31:12.920
You won’t have to use them. Yeah. Principals apply everywhere, right?

00:31:13.480 –> 00:31:15.420
You just may not have to use them all.

00:31:16.500 –> 00:31:20.660
So is it safe to say with a name like Metropolitan and finishing school that

00:31:20.660 –> 00:31:26.840
you intentionally targeted helping women more so than general populace?

00:31:26.960 –> 00:31:31.160
Or would you consider yourself like whoever wants to know their forum?

00:31:31.340 –> 00:31:33.860
Or are you really targeting women?

00:31:34.638 –> 00:31:39.078
So my goal and intention, so I created a class called Asphalt Anthropology,

00:31:39.098 –> 00:31:42.238
which is really what I’m most known for.

00:31:42.498 –> 00:31:47.298
And that, my goal is specifically for women. But I will tell you,

00:31:47.418 –> 00:31:50.298
I have 50-50 men and women showing up to classes.

00:31:50.558 –> 00:31:54.798
Sometimes it’s a little bit more women, but I have plenty of men coming.

00:31:55.438 –> 00:32:00.378
I’m a very big believer in being specific and knowing your audience and knowing

00:32:00.378 –> 00:32:06.078
what their needs and their pain points are. And so that’s how I’ve kind of gone

00:32:06.078 –> 00:32:09.798
about my business, but it has also attracted people who live in this environment.

00:32:10.018 –> 00:32:13.238
They’re like, I run into this situation too. And just because I’m a dude,

00:32:13.498 –> 00:32:15.358
I still don’t know how to deal with it.

00:32:15.538 –> 00:32:21.278
So I’m not going to exclude anyone, but in my conversations,

00:32:21.798 –> 00:32:27.278
it is about particularly for women, but it is, costs are absolutely open for anyone. Yeah.

00:32:27.938 –> 00:32:30.678
Yeah. And it sounds like you’ve got a good mixed turnout anyway.

00:32:31.978 –> 00:32:35.558
So I know we wanted to talk about your asphalt anthropology.

00:32:35.818 –> 00:32:36.978
You want to get into that now?

00:32:37.298 –> 00:32:42.078
Yeah, let’s do that. Yeah. So, yeah, so Asphalt Anthropology,

00:32:42.318 –> 00:32:43.578
it’s an hour and a half class.

00:32:43.938 –> 00:32:48.858
And depending on certain circumstances, we’ll either do a people watching course

00:32:48.858 –> 00:32:53.158
after it for a small group. But it’s always kind of the core curriculum where

00:32:53.158 –> 00:32:57.418
we get into, you know, kind of the basic skills for navigating the city.

00:32:57.518 –> 00:33:03.098
And it really starts with myth busting. And that’s been some myths so that people

00:33:03.098 –> 00:33:06.558
can kind of change their frame of reference and talk about, you know,

00:33:06.658 –> 00:33:08.638
goals that people have for committing violence.

00:33:09.178 –> 00:33:16.518
And, you know, if someone is just after your stuff, like you do not want to,

00:33:16.518 –> 00:33:19.238
like, necessarily try to deescalate that.

00:33:19.378 –> 00:33:24.138
Right. Or even someone who completely set a different set of circumstances is mentally ill.

00:33:24.418 –> 00:33:27.658
You know, I’ve been lucky there’s a couple of times I deescalated it because

00:33:27.658 –> 00:33:29.598
I was cornered. Like, I wouldn’t recommend that.

00:33:29.978 –> 00:33:33.958
Right. Like my, my, one of my big sayings is always distance is your best friend,

00:33:34.098 –> 00:33:35.278
like always get distance.

00:33:36.098 –> 00:33:39.378
So, you know, it’s, it’s kind of about busting those myths.

00:33:39.558 –> 00:33:42.318
Like, you know, people will say, oh, violence never solves anything.

00:33:42.318 –> 00:33:45.798
And I feel like when people say that, and if they believe that,

00:33:45.938 –> 00:33:50.178
that’s sticking your head in the sand and not acknowledging that in the moment

00:33:50.178 –> 00:33:51.918
it actually solves it for that person.

00:33:52.138 –> 00:33:55.838
Yeah. And if they’re willing to threaten you with violence or they’re willing

00:33:55.838 –> 00:34:01.438
to use violence, then you need to just like, let’s have really upfront conversations about it.

00:34:01.678 –> 00:34:05.478
And one of the big things, again, and I just kind of coincidentally posted about

00:34:05.478 –> 00:34:10.938
it today on Instagram is the myth of the first responder versus an emergency responder.

00:34:11.338 –> 00:34:17.318
So an emergency responder are, you know, firefighters, police officers, EMTs.

00:34:17.598 –> 00:34:20.958
Those are people whose everyday lives, they get a lot of practice in dealing

00:34:20.958 –> 00:34:23.358
with emergencies. They get training related to that.

00:34:24.150 –> 00:34:29.230
But for you and me walking down or me, it sounds like you’re in that one of those fields.

00:34:29.450 –> 00:34:35.630
But for me, I’m a business person. And even though I study these things, it’s not my job.

00:34:35.890 –> 00:34:41.070
But the first responder, I am still the first responder because it’s hairs that

00:34:41.070 –> 00:34:45.050
go up on the back of my neck or it’s that feeling I get in my stomach or the

00:34:45.050 –> 00:34:47.950
thing that catches my eye. That’s the first responder.

00:34:48.390 –> 00:34:51.790
Because if you wait for like some superman

00:34:51.790 –> 00:34:54.550
to come in and save you while you’re getting mugs you think

00:34:54.550 –> 00:34:57.490
if you think they’re going to punch him in the mugger in the nose and

00:34:57.490 –> 00:35:03.670
forget about it that’s just not reality it’s not reality and when you know if

00:35:03.670 –> 00:35:08.170
we hear this all the time like oh i called the cops and they didn’t come for

00:35:08.170 –> 00:35:11.770
an hour and it’s like yeah they’re and they’re only good they’re going to get

00:35:11.770 –> 00:35:14.730
there and they’re going to do paperwork right like they would like to maybe

00:35:14.730 –> 00:35:17.010
do more, but like, there’s only so much they can do.

00:35:17.130 –> 00:35:21.550
And it’s really interesting to kind of have those conversations because I think

00:35:21.550 –> 00:35:27.350
there is this misconception of, oh, if I’m getting mugged and if I can call

00:35:27.350 –> 00:35:28.790
the cops, like I’ll be okay.

00:35:28.870 –> 00:35:31.090
Or if there’s more cops around, I’ll be okay.

00:35:31.290 –> 00:35:37.790
And so my approach is, yeah, like if those things happen to me around, that’s awesome.

00:35:38.010 –> 00:35:42.430
Or even like a security guard, or even just like a really kind bystander.

00:35:42.630 –> 00:35:44.790
Like, you can’t count on that happening.

00:35:45.010 –> 00:35:47.370
It does happen. And it’s nice when it does.

00:35:47.690 –> 00:35:52.930
But you like the first thing you’ve got to do is like, why does my gut feel

00:35:52.930 –> 00:35:55.370
that way? Like, pay attention to that, honor that.

00:35:55.510 –> 00:36:00.070
And so we kind of we in asphalt, we go through one breaking that myth down.

00:36:00.230 –> 00:36:03.250
And to like, okay, what are the cues that you’re seeing?

00:36:03.390 –> 00:36:07.450
Because a lot of times, I also share with people, it’s like,

00:36:07.550 –> 00:36:10.830
you don’t have to necessarily know exactly what the problem is to just leave and get out.

00:36:11.110 –> 00:36:15.110
But if you can articulate it to yourself, it’s valuable because then you can

00:36:15.110 –> 00:36:16.590
kind of see it in other contexts.

00:36:16.830 –> 00:36:21.130
If you have to articulate it to a police officer, that’s helpful too.

00:36:21.590 –> 00:36:27.730
But the idea of being able to trust your guide, I taught a class one time where

00:36:27.730 –> 00:36:31.470
we were talking about red flags and being targeted by someone.

00:36:31.710 –> 00:36:37.550
And the student said, well, I was out for a run and this car started following me slow.

00:36:37.970 –> 00:36:41.630
And so I went down a cul-de-sac and they turned down the cul-de-sac and then

00:36:41.630 –> 00:36:45.050
I came out of the cul-de-sac, they came out of the cul-de-sac and I went down

00:36:45.050 –> 00:36:46.970
another cul-de-sac and they followed me.

00:36:47.190 –> 00:36:49.170
And then finally I outran them and got away.

00:36:49.430 –> 00:36:53.410
And the question to me was, were there any red flags there? And I was like,

00:36:53.410 –> 00:36:55.610
what took you so long? Every red flag.

00:36:56.230 –> 00:36:59.790
Yeah. It’s like you just did. And I, and I feel like, you know,

00:36:59.830 –> 00:37:01.210
she’s a very bright woman.

00:37:01.370 –> 00:37:04.250
She, you know, and a smart woman. It’s not that she didn’t know,

00:37:04.330 –> 00:37:07.470
but it’s just that, you know, we’re not used to seeing the world.

00:37:07.990 –> 00:37:11.630
In that way. And so that’s why we kind of get into the psychology a bit of like,

00:37:11.850 –> 00:37:14.070
what a bad guy, you know, look for how they operate.

00:37:14.270 –> 00:37:16.750
And so like, if you see that thing.

00:37:17.534 –> 00:37:20.874
And a cluster of things, like you need to make a plan.

00:37:21.194 –> 00:37:24.314
And it’s all based on behavior. I’m very big on this is not that,

00:37:24.474 –> 00:37:25.854
you know, based on how someone’s dressed.

00:37:26.074 –> 00:37:29.174
This is not based on the color of their skin or the baseball cap they’re wearing.

00:37:29.314 –> 00:37:33.514
You need to be able to articulate what that behavior is there.

00:37:33.654 –> 00:37:37.794
You know, they’re looking at you and inching forward and trying to be sneaky

00:37:37.794 –> 00:37:43.554
about it, or they’re kind of like no one else on the train and they come and sit next you.

00:37:43.894 –> 00:37:48.694
Those are specific behaviors. So I’m really trying to combat the whole Karen

00:37:48.694 –> 00:37:52.274
freaking out and calling the cops and everybody.

00:37:52.494 –> 00:37:58.034
I feel like this hopefully can be a skill that people can look at specific behaviors

00:37:58.034 –> 00:38:03.394
and be like, okay, I need to take action. And what’s that action going to be?

00:38:03.634 –> 00:38:07.254
I also walk folks through the different kinds of violence.

00:38:07.454 –> 00:38:12.174
There’s the social versus predatory, what you can de-escalate, what you need to avoid.

00:38:12.914 –> 00:38:17.514
Pre-attack cues we get into both like the imminent stuff, like how they’re,

00:38:17.594 –> 00:38:22.154
you know, getting red in the face or just how they’re kind of physically responding

00:38:22.154 –> 00:38:24.794
or again, the behavioral stuff.

00:38:25.154 –> 00:38:31.874
You know, this stuff I’ve learned through hard knocks, you know, it’s like I,

00:38:32.294 –> 00:38:36.234
you know, when I was a kid, kind of the biggest challenge in my household when

00:38:36.234 –> 00:38:40.554
I was about 10 or 12 that I wanted to go for a walk downtown and my parents

00:38:40.554 –> 00:38:41.894
were like, no, that’s dangerous.

00:38:42.234 –> 00:38:46.554
And so I found out, like they just couldn’t keep me hemmed in.

00:38:46.694 –> 00:38:49.974
And so I just found out really young that like I need to kind of keep my act

00:38:49.974 –> 00:38:51.854
together or my parents will never let me out.

00:38:52.598 –> 00:38:57.398
And so, you know, a lot of the wisdom, you know, for all my martial arts training,

00:38:57.458 –> 00:39:02.198
a lot of the wisdom, I really feel it comes from the 10-year-old girl that I

00:39:02.198 –> 00:39:04.818
once was that knew how to dodge trouble. Yeah.

00:39:05.078 –> 00:39:09.158
And that’s not unique to me. I’m not saying that to build myself up.

00:39:09.278 –> 00:39:12.158
I’m saying as human beings were wired for survival.

00:39:12.318 –> 00:39:17.418
And even at 10, I knew that guy looking at me funny or that car slowing down is trouble.

00:39:17.678 –> 00:39:22.738
Yeah. So listen to that. Don’t like hang out in asphalt. We also talk about,

00:39:22.738 –> 00:39:27.238
you know, the mindset of like rudeness, like it’s okay to be rude.

00:39:27.398 –> 00:39:30.278
I’m from the East Coast right outside Philly. So I, I’m like,

00:39:30.458 –> 00:39:31.858
okay with that. It’s built in.

00:39:32.238 –> 00:39:39.318
Like, yeah, some of my classes, I literally have to teach, coach the women, like it’s okay.

00:39:39.498 –> 00:39:42.558
And like, you know, they may not get to 10 on a scale of one to 10.

00:39:42.698 –> 00:39:44.898
If they get to a five in that class, that’s okay.

00:39:45.058 –> 00:39:48.118
But we need to like get you to a 10 at some point.

00:39:48.298 –> 00:39:50.678
Yeah. So it’s like kind of that, it’s that mindset.

00:39:51.098 –> 00:39:57.258
And then conversely, and this is going to sound kind of opposite of self-defense.

00:39:57.578 –> 00:40:00.858
And I’ve kind of taken some heat for this in some articles I’ve written,

00:40:01.078 –> 00:40:02.478
but the idea of compassion.

00:40:03.218 –> 00:40:07.858
And again, living where I live in Los Angeles, there’s a lot of homelessness.

00:40:08.118 –> 00:40:13.378
There’s a lot of people really suffering. and I am pretty good at just kind

00:40:13.378 –> 00:40:17.158
of like keeping going keeping my head down and just like going to where I’m going.

00:40:17.918 –> 00:40:20.758
But there have also been times where there was something

00:40:20.758 –> 00:40:24.658
inside of me that said I need to reach out to that person and do something and

00:40:24.658 –> 00:40:28.858
you know I wrote an article about that a couple of months ago where this young

00:40:28.858 –> 00:40:33.458
woman had walked into a restaurant where I was sitting and it was like me and

00:40:33.458 –> 00:40:38.178
like two other people sitting in the restaurant and she just smelled of the street she looked,

00:40:38.726 –> 00:40:44.386
shovels. And she just came in like this broken animal, just like this scared

00:40:44.386 –> 00:40:46.006
deer or whatever you want to say.

00:40:46.266 –> 00:40:50.406
And she skirted around the sides of the restaurant. And then she just made a

00:40:50.406 –> 00:40:54.366
beeline to a table that had not been bussed and just started eating the food there.

00:40:55.106 –> 00:41:00.606
And there’s all that calculation that we have to do in that,

00:41:00.706 –> 00:41:03.586
do I want to help this person? What’s the risk to myself.

00:41:03.966 –> 00:41:09.006
And I made the calculation to give her some cash, which is like super, super rare for me.

00:41:09.506 –> 00:41:12.586
So I gave her some cash and I had to hand it to her because I thought,

00:41:12.706 –> 00:41:15.206
well, if I put it on the table, don’t think she’s stealing it.

00:41:15.306 –> 00:41:16.246
So let me just give her cash.

00:41:16.646 –> 00:41:20.446
And so I did that. And when I wrote about the experience and kind of like detailing,

00:41:20.486 –> 00:41:24.846
like the things I looked for, and I talked about some of the times where I screwed

00:41:24.846 –> 00:41:28.426
up and it didn’t go so well, you know, I kind of caught some heat for it,

00:41:28.606 –> 00:41:31.346
you know, from folks who are kind of more of the military mindset.

00:41:31.346 –> 00:41:33.906
And they’re Like, well, you know, if you reach out like that,

00:41:34.066 –> 00:41:34.886
you’re going to end up dead.

00:41:35.026 –> 00:41:40.766
And it’s like, you know, maybe in some places you can kind of have that colder heart.

00:41:41.166 –> 00:41:44.966
For me personally, if I see it every day, I can’t be a robot.

00:41:45.226 –> 00:41:50.926
I have to be discerning, but not, you know, a bleeding heart, but discerning.

00:41:51.266 –> 00:41:55.866
And, you know, and that’s something that does come up in classes from time to time.

00:41:55.986 –> 00:41:59.806
And I talk to other female instructors that I think they’ll say,

00:41:59.986 –> 00:42:03.086
students will say this to other women, And maybe not so much to men instructors,

00:42:03.446 –> 00:42:07.426
but like, you know, there’s that compassion side or how can I help side.

00:42:08.154 –> 00:42:13.394
And it’s tough. I mean, it’s tough when you see people in some of these situations.

00:42:13.694 –> 00:42:17.954
And, you know, I’m not going to fix the world. I understand that.

00:42:18.074 –> 00:42:21.874
But, you know, for that one person, if I can facilitate a meal,

00:42:22.174 –> 00:42:25.554
you know, that’s something else. Yeah, you know, you make a great point.

00:42:25.734 –> 00:42:30.594
And you’re the first person that I’ve ever talked to or had any self-defense

00:42:30.594 –> 00:42:36.734
conversation with that brings in the concept of compassion relative to self-defense.

00:42:36.914 –> 00:42:39.094
And it’s not that it has anything to do with self-defense.

00:42:39.334 –> 00:42:44.154
It’s about, to the word that you use, discerning when you should and shouldn’t

00:42:44.154 –> 00:42:45.814
get involved at that level, right?

00:42:45.814 –> 00:42:50.954
And there’s going to be times where you may feel compelled to show compassion at,

00:42:51.094 –> 00:42:55.934
because if you followed the typical self-defense formula, you would just walk

00:42:55.934 –> 00:43:00.914
on by and avoid that not knowing, you know, or maybe your gut is telling you

00:43:00.914 –> 00:43:03.674
this could be a little off for whatever reason.

00:43:03.874 –> 00:43:08.454
Normally you’d walk by that or whatever the case may be, but yeah,

00:43:08.474 –> 00:43:12.574
that’s, that’s my, that’s my takeaway for today. I think.

00:43:13.594 –> 00:43:16.754
Cool. You know, and there’s absolutely, you know, I’m not going to judge you

00:43:16.754 –> 00:43:19.574
if for anybody, if they, if they just keep walking, right.

00:43:19.674 –> 00:43:22.914
Like they’re going to do what they need to do because they’re ultimately responsibility

00:43:22.914 –> 00:43:25.034
is to them and to their family. Right.

00:43:25.234 –> 00:43:28.854
And it’s like, I, you know, just, you see it so much. It’s like,

00:43:28.974 –> 00:43:32.994
it’s just, it just weighs on you. And I feel like I become less human.

00:43:33.434 –> 00:43:38.474
Yeah. If I don’t act on those times where I’ve determined that it’s safe for me.

00:43:38.674 –> 00:43:42.954
So, you know, this, what the conversation we’re having may not be appropriate. for everybody.

00:43:43.194 –> 00:43:46.034
And I just want to make that distinction as well. But, you know,

00:43:46.074 –> 00:43:51.674
I feel like with discernment, there’s another possibility that’s available.

00:43:52.014 –> 00:43:55.854
Well, I think, you know, again, you make a great point, compassion,

00:43:56.454 –> 00:44:01.194
discernment, and, you know, it ties back in, in my mind, to listening to that

00:44:01.194 –> 00:44:05.834
sixth sense, that intuition, those, as I said on a previous podcast,

00:44:06.154 –> 00:44:08.554
you know, the spidey senses, right?

00:44:08.754 –> 00:44:13.494
And then being able to interpret those, like it’s okay to be rude.

00:44:13.494 –> 00:44:18.854
It’s okay to keep on walking, but maybe you interpret your spidey senses as

00:44:18.854 –> 00:44:24.314
I actually need to help this or help this individual or reach out to this particular person this time.

00:44:24.674 –> 00:44:30.834
Normally, when I have these feelings in my gut, I need to keep walking.

00:44:30.994 –> 00:44:34.394
But in this case, there’s something telling me I have an opportunity to help

00:44:34.394 –> 00:44:37.514
and just being able to, again, use that word, discern.

00:44:37.854 –> 00:44:42.374
But the point is listening to those, to your intuition and those spidey senses.

00:44:43.219 –> 00:44:47.179
Yeah. We’re on the same page. Yep. Absolutely.

00:44:48.699 –> 00:44:53.059
So, you know, I think I mentioned to you previously that I talked to Kelly with

00:44:53.059 –> 00:44:57.099
the Diamond Arrow group and you said you’d talk to her a few times at least or whatever.

00:44:57.119 –> 00:45:03.159
And she did a little bit of research to try to understand why women in particular

00:45:03.159 –> 00:45:08.199
just did not do more with their personal safety or didn’t take it more serious

00:45:08.199 –> 00:45:10.259
or however you want to say that.

00:45:10.259 –> 00:45:17.959
And I think the two main things seem to keep women out of learning more about

00:45:17.959 –> 00:45:24.919
taking their personal safety more serious or studying more about personal safety

00:45:24.919 –> 00:45:27.419
and what they should be doing for themselves and their loved ones.

00:45:27.879 –> 00:45:32.659
And the two things that she uncovered was one was time for themselves.

00:45:32.959 –> 00:45:37.239
Maybe they have careers. They get home. They got two crazy kids running around

00:45:37.239 –> 00:45:40.159
the house. They got their hubbies coming home, whatever it is.

00:45:40.259 –> 00:45:47.079
So having time or being able to make the time to be able to look further into that.

00:45:47.239 –> 00:45:49.879
And then the other reason was is just intimidation, you know,

00:45:50.199 –> 00:45:54.499
intimidation and going to classes, intimidation about getting beat up by other

00:45:54.499 –> 00:45:57.419
women or bigger men, whatever the case may be.

00:45:58.959 –> 00:46:02.779
What what do you see as being the challenges? And then, you know,

00:46:02.899 –> 00:46:04.699
what can we do about some of this?

00:46:04.819 –> 00:46:08.519
Right. That’s like an ongoing question I’m trying to figure out. Oh, heck, yeah.

00:46:08.759 –> 00:46:15.579
I’ve been grappling with that question for decades. And those answers are a good start.

00:46:15.819 –> 00:46:21.039
I think that those kind of get at the surface of why people don’t take it.

00:46:21.239 –> 00:46:25.779
But I think, and I’m totally guilty of this. I’m like, I did all the slurks.

00:46:25.819 –> 00:46:26.979
Why is no one coming to my class?

00:46:27.219 –> 00:46:30.859
But I think we’re asking the wrong question. I think that’s definitely the wrong

00:46:30.859 –> 00:46:32.999
question. I think the question is,

00:46:33.406 –> 00:46:36.346
what problem am I solving for somebody? Yeah.

00:46:36.726 –> 00:46:40.546
And that’s just like how business, no matter what your business is,

00:46:40.706 –> 00:46:42.746
that’s how it goes about with things.

00:46:42.906 –> 00:46:47.026
So if people aren’t showing up for your classes, it’s never your audience’s fault.

00:46:47.346 –> 00:46:51.686
If people aren’t showing up, it’s about you pivoting and rethinking your message.

00:46:52.046 –> 00:46:57.466
And so, you know, whether it’s a personal safety class, whether it’s,

00:46:57.466 –> 00:47:01.026
you know, a movie, whether no matter what the product is,

00:47:01.466 –> 00:47:04.586
you know, people, before they give up their time and money, because those are

00:47:04.586 –> 00:47:08.426
just very precious commodities, they want to know that you’re solving a problem.

00:47:08.766 –> 00:47:14.866
And so I worked for a large company at one time where I was the director of

00:47:14.866 –> 00:47:18.006
business development. And I had people coming to me all the time.

00:47:18.166 –> 00:47:21.846
Part of my job was to hear pitches about their app idea.

00:47:22.406 –> 00:47:26.126
Apps were like the new sexy thing. Everybody had to have an app.

00:47:26.226 –> 00:47:29.986
And everybody that had an idea for an app thought it was just going to change the world.

00:47:30.166 –> 00:47:33.186
And the question always is, what problem is this going to solve?

00:47:33.466 –> 00:47:39.146
It’s up to me. We’re either going to invest in this or partner with you or we’re going to pass.

00:47:39.506 –> 00:47:42.866
And the question always starts with, what problem are you solving?

00:47:43.406 –> 00:47:49.706
And I think this is really profound in the self-defense space is that we have

00:47:49.706 –> 00:47:55.806
a lot of folks who maybe have huge experience with, you know, history of, you know,

00:47:56.206 –> 00:48:01.386
working in security or being in law enforcement, or maybe they’ve meddled in some kind of combat art.

00:48:01.546 –> 00:48:05.406
And so they think that they have the solutions. They see the problem and they

00:48:05.406 –> 00:48:06.886
think they have the solution to it.

00:48:07.237 –> 00:48:11.137
But what they actually have is a hammer, and they think everything looks like a nail.

00:48:11.477 –> 00:48:16.797
And so women are really, I’m going to just focus on women here. Women are really smart.

00:48:16.997 –> 00:48:22.337
They know that learning how to punch somebody in the face is not going to solve their problem.

00:48:22.817 –> 00:48:26.637
They know that it’s much more complex and nuanced than that.

00:48:27.057 –> 00:48:33.157
And I’m not at all going to bash the physical stuff, because the physical stuff

00:48:33.157 –> 00:48:37.137
will give you a physical confidence that will carry you through life.

00:48:37.237 –> 00:48:39.437
And help you accomplish so much. Absolutely.

00:48:39.737 –> 00:48:42.497
Professionally, personally, just being out, not bashing that.

00:48:42.997 –> 00:48:48.097
But, you know, we need to get really real about just because a lot of times

00:48:48.097 –> 00:48:49.937
I feel like, oh, I can teach you how to punch.

00:48:50.057 –> 00:48:52.837
Well, that’s a solution looking for a problem.

00:48:53.137 –> 00:48:58.477
Yeah. And if I’m teaching you how to punch, but I’m not teaching you how to

00:48:58.477 –> 00:49:02.957
mitigate some of the other situations that may come up for particularly,

00:49:03.337 –> 00:49:06.197
again, we’re talking about women, then I’m really falling short.

00:49:06.717 –> 00:49:09.477
I’ve worked with women who have done everything they were told to do.

00:49:09.597 –> 00:49:13.537
They took Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu and they took Kabbalah, which is billed as the

00:49:13.537 –> 00:49:14.937
answer to self-defense.

00:49:15.097 –> 00:49:18.437
Everything, right. Well, they still went to a party and got sexually assaulted

00:49:18.437 –> 00:49:22.777
because it was someone they knew and it was at a party. And they didn’t know what to do at the time.

00:49:22.957 –> 00:49:26.857
And then there was the aftermath of like, well, do I tell my friends?

00:49:26.857 –> 00:49:31.277
I don’t want to be this person again. So like until you’re like actually solving

00:49:31.277 –> 00:49:35.797
a problem, physical self or any kind of self-defense class is only going to

00:49:35.797 –> 00:49:38.797
attract the people that say, Oh, that’s the problem that I have.

00:49:39.077 –> 00:49:41.537
And, you know, with the physical self-defense.

00:49:42.211 –> 00:49:45.111
You know, you’re going to get people like me who, first of all,

00:49:45.191 –> 00:49:49.831
just love punching things and hitting and it’s just, it feels good and it’s a relief.

00:49:50.271 –> 00:49:54.951
You’re also going to get folks to maybe have been through an experience and

00:49:54.951 –> 00:49:58.811
that, and they know that that’s a problem that they need. Like they don’t want that to happen again.

00:49:59.151 –> 00:50:03.431
And so if you are teaching physical self-defense and you’ve got to,

00:50:03.551 –> 00:50:06.251
you’re going to have a good chunk of people who have had an experience.

00:50:06.391 –> 00:50:10.571
So you darn better be sure that you know how to deal with folks who are,

00:50:10.831 –> 00:50:11.731
have been through trauma.

00:50:12.211 –> 00:50:19.331
And I’ve had that experience and just kind of go back to like why Metropolitan Finishing School.

00:50:19.451 –> 00:50:24.771
It’s like I am an expert and really good at walking down the street and like dodging trouble.

00:50:24.951 –> 00:50:28.171
Like I can see it a mile away and I can manage it. I’m really good at that.

00:50:28.531 –> 00:50:33.851
The only person who’s ever put his hands on me was my ex-boyfriend who was like

00:50:33.851 –> 00:50:37.251
lost his shit and just like I was able to protect myself.

00:50:37.531 –> 00:50:44.291
But it was a very bad scene. And so for me, getting back into the swing of things

00:50:44.291 –> 00:50:47.311
was so incredibly helpful and valuable.

00:50:47.311 –> 00:50:54.931
But I feel like because the dominant voices in self-defense tend to be coming

00:50:54.931 –> 00:51:00.711
from law enforcement or military, those are people who deal with dark things all the time. Every day.

00:51:00.871 –> 00:51:04.631
So they know what can happen, right? They absolutely know it.

00:51:04.731 –> 00:51:07.671
And I know that without a doubt, they come from a great place.

00:51:07.791 –> 00:51:10.751
They don’t want that to ever happen to anyone else ever again.

00:51:11.111 –> 00:51:14.671
But the truth of the matter is most people walking around who don’t have to

00:51:14.671 –> 00:51:17.371
deal with that every day, that’s just not a problem to them.

00:51:17.631 –> 00:51:19.731
They feel fine. They feel confident.

00:51:20.311 –> 00:51:25.131
And I think one thing that’s really missing is it’s not so much I’m going to

00:51:25.131 –> 00:51:29.591
teach you how to punch somebody in the face, but it’s about embodying.

00:51:30.191 –> 00:51:33.351
No one’s going to fuck with me. Yeah. Pardon my language. No,

00:51:33.491 –> 00:51:34.731
no, it’s perfectly fine.

00:51:35.091 –> 00:51:39.531
No, no. You can drop F-bombs ad nauseum if you like. It’s my favorite word.

00:51:39.671 –> 00:51:42.131
I just, yeah, absolutely. Oh, good. Okay. Yeah.

00:51:42.531 –> 00:51:46.751
I am a big time cursor and I’m pretty good today.

00:51:46.831 –> 00:51:52.331
That was just like the best place to do it, right? Like no one’s going to fuck with me. It’s all good.

00:51:52.551 –> 00:51:54.691
And that’s the right attitude to have. Yeah.

00:51:55.516 –> 00:51:58.896
Right. And it doesn’t have to be you’re an angry person either.

00:51:59.076 –> 00:52:00.256
Like there’s like that distinction.

00:52:00.756 –> 00:52:05.436
So, you know, I, so in terms and Kelly’s story is really interesting because

00:52:05.436 –> 00:52:10.016
I talked to her kind of not so long ago and she’s had one, like one single self

00:52:10.016 –> 00:52:13.316
defense class in her entire life. And it sounded like it was a terrible experience.

00:52:13.736 –> 00:52:18.236
And so for her, like she was like, oh, I still want to learn stuff.

00:52:18.436 –> 00:52:21.296
But like, this is a terrible experience. So she hasn’t gone back and done any

00:52:21.296 –> 00:52:22.876
other self-sense classes that I know of.

00:52:23.176 –> 00:52:26.316
And then, but she, you know, took it on to educate herself.

00:52:26.516 –> 00:52:29.696
So she reads a lot of books and I know she talks to her husband who’s a police officer.

00:52:29.856 –> 00:52:33.576
So that’s like, she’s, you know, she’s still new in this industry and,

00:52:33.716 –> 00:52:35.376
you know, kind of learning all this stuff.

00:52:35.656 –> 00:52:40.756
And, you know, it’s, I think she’s like a great case study of someone who,

00:52:41.196 –> 00:52:44.436
you know, doesn’t have the answers, but is grappling for them.

00:52:44.556 –> 00:52:47.716
And so it’s really interesting to watch her grow and learn through this.

00:52:47.716 –> 00:52:50.516
Because, you know, again, that question, why people aren’t coming.

00:52:50.876 –> 00:52:53.636
Oh, heck, you know, I’ve been grappling with that for decades.

00:52:53.796 –> 00:52:56.476
My teacher before me has been grappling with that.

00:52:56.596 –> 00:52:59.896
So it’s nothing new. But I think, you know, again, you know,

00:52:59.916 –> 00:53:03.556
this business nerd over here, I look at it from a business perspective,

00:53:03.816 –> 00:53:06.276
which is, are you solving someone’s problem?

00:53:06.556 –> 00:53:10.296
And I think that most classes are not.

00:53:10.476 –> 00:53:15.056
Yeah. so let me ask you go ahead yeah well I was going to say one more thing

00:53:15.056 –> 00:53:19.316
it’s like not only are you not solving a problem that they have but then we

00:53:19.316 –> 00:53:21.796
resort to fear and tell people well you.

00:53:22.256 –> 00:53:27.676
Better come to my class right because you should be afraid and you know one

00:53:27.676 –> 00:53:30.756
thing that kind of I try to focus on it’s like.

00:53:31.337 –> 00:53:35.617
Instead of being afraid of your environment, let’s be curious about your environment.

00:53:36.017 –> 00:53:39.877
Instead of looking paranoid over your shoulder for the boogeyman.

00:53:40.897 –> 00:53:43.817
What changed in your environment today?

00:53:44.037 –> 00:53:46.637
It might be that your neighbor just painted their shutters a different color.

00:53:46.977 –> 00:53:53.117
And if you’re engaged with your environment, I think of myself as an urban explorer

00:53:53.117 –> 00:53:55.537
first and a self-defense instructor second.

00:53:55.537 –> 00:54:01.637
Now, that approach may be useless for some people, but that’s an expression

00:54:01.637 –> 00:54:04.717
of who I am and the people that I want to reach.

00:54:05.437 –> 00:54:12.817
Yeah, and that comes through on your Instagram posts, very much so.

00:54:12.977 –> 00:54:17.677
I think that’s fascinating about your post is that you’re never really directly

00:54:17.677 –> 00:54:19.357
talking about the subject matter.

00:54:19.737 –> 00:54:25.397
You’re going about it a very indirect way by showing the neighborhood, so to speak.

00:54:25.537 –> 00:54:30.297
And I think that’s a great way to get people stimulated to start thinking in

00:54:30.297 –> 00:54:32.177
similar ways in similar fashion.

00:54:32.417 –> 00:54:38.057
So yeah, I think at least for me, and maybe I’m one of the few that pick up on it. I hope not.

00:54:38.557 –> 00:54:42.997
But it’s very obvious that you’re the explorer and show it that way.

00:54:43.197 –> 00:54:44.297
Show your world that way.

00:54:45.257 –> 00:54:50.317
Yeah. You know, one of the best books I’ve read about situational awareness

00:54:50.317 –> 00:54:53.357
is not directly about situational awareness, but it’s about,

00:54:53.537 –> 00:54:56.297
it’s called Visual Intelligence by Amy Herman.

00:54:56.517 –> 00:55:04.637
Do you know that book? I have not heard of it, but the title immediately resonated with me. So, yeah.

00:55:05.716 –> 00:55:09.036
It’s so she’s a lawyer and she’s also an art historian.

00:55:09.276 –> 00:55:15.396
She teaches looking at art to law enforcement, to CEOs, to medical professionals.

00:55:15.876 –> 00:55:19.976
And the reason she teaches looking at art, because she is like a still photograph

00:55:19.976 –> 00:55:24.316
one, because when you go out in the public, like it always changes and you never

00:55:24.316 –> 00:55:25.456
know if you’re right about things.

00:55:25.456 –> 00:55:30.356
But in looking at art, she has you like really look and she teaches you how

00:55:30.356 –> 00:55:33.116
to really look at things and how to deduce things.

00:55:33.276 –> 00:55:36.356
And then because it’s an art with history, we know, oh, yeah,

00:55:36.436 –> 00:55:39.236
that is taken at this time and this person, that kind of thing.

00:55:39.856 –> 00:55:43.636
And to me, it’s not directly related to situational awareness.

00:55:43.916 –> 00:55:48.316
But to me, it’s the best book about situational awareness because it’s reading

00:55:48.316 –> 00:55:51.596
your environment, but not from a place of like that military mindset.

00:55:51.596 –> 00:55:55.316
That we run into a lot of like, okay, I’m going through my environment and I

00:55:55.316 –> 00:55:56.696
got to look out for who’s trying to kill me.

00:55:57.156 –> 00:56:04.316
And like, I, I inhabit some pretty sketchy neighborhoods and I am like,

00:56:04.556 –> 00:56:06.716
not like, no one’s trying to kill me.

00:56:06.876 –> 00:56:11.816
You know what I mean? It’s like, I, when I teach classes on skid row, I have a goal.

00:56:12.016 –> 00:56:15.216
Like I walk to class because I shouldn’t drive. Like that’s just a personal value.

00:56:15.316 –> 00:56:19.036
I shouldn’t drive. Like I need to know what these people are dealing with. and i

00:56:19.036 –> 00:56:22.256
like walk and it’s like i’ve i’ve been in some of the sketchiest

00:56:22.256 –> 00:56:25.916
parts of of this country and others and you

00:56:25.916 –> 00:56:28.996
know if you can’t walk through like nice little

00:56:28.996 –> 00:56:33.116
suburban cincinnati or whatever like i don’t even know cincinnati but like if

00:56:33.116 –> 00:56:36.956
you’re walking around with that much fear like let’s go for a walk in skid row

00:56:36.956 –> 00:56:41.556
and like let’s let’s talk about how to mitigate these environments yeah anyway

00:56:41.556 –> 00:56:47.336
i just kind of went off on a tangent because my goal is like not fear but curiosity

00:56:47.336 –> 00:56:48.676
Like, let’s get curious.

00:56:49.404 –> 00:56:53.444
And that way, not only are we like sparking joy in ourselves,

00:56:53.624 –> 00:56:56.264
but we’re also doing that for, you know, kids we may be teaching.

00:56:56.424 –> 00:56:59.364
Like, who wants to tell your child that the world is a scary place?

00:56:59.784 –> 00:57:02.824
But get them to ask questions and be curious. Yeah.

00:57:04.084 –> 00:57:08.024
So this isn’t about me. It’s about you. But, you know, you do make me think

00:57:08.024 –> 00:57:11.864
like I’ve got all this knowledge or at least I think I have all this knowledge.

00:57:12.004 –> 00:57:16.124
Right. It’s one of the reasons why I wanted to get started doing what I’m trying to do now.

00:57:17.244 –> 00:57:20.264
And you know i want to give back because i think it’s important i

00:57:20.264 –> 00:57:23.204
think it’s good information i think it’s a lot of information that

00:57:23.204 –> 00:57:27.824
people don’t know or don’t have and or a lot of information dare i say people

00:57:27.824 –> 00:57:32.164
don’t care about but the one thing that i haven’t done to your point is look

00:57:32.164 –> 00:57:35.744
at it from the business perspective of saying hey is there really a problem

00:57:35.744 –> 00:57:39.324
i’m trying to solve with all this great information that i want to give back

00:57:39.324 –> 00:57:43.024
with right that i want to give back yeah So,

00:57:44.144 –> 00:57:50.464
knowing that people do need to take their personal safety more seriously or

00:57:50.464 –> 00:57:54.944
get involved with it at all, what is the answer?

00:57:55.084 –> 00:57:59.464
What is the problem we’re trying to solve as a self-defense personal safety community?

00:58:00.484 –> 00:58:02.924
Wow, you asked me that like I know.

00:58:06.284 –> 00:58:09.204
What is the problem you know i i’ve met i’ve

00:58:09.204 –> 00:58:11.884
met people from all walks of life that you know

00:58:11.884 –> 00:58:14.984
they think because they moved into their gated community

00:58:14.984 –> 00:58:17.784
or moved into whatever town that’s why they move

00:58:17.784 –> 00:58:21.224
there so it’s safe and they don’t even give it a second thought i’ve

00:58:21.224 –> 00:58:24.264
met people that leave their doors unlocked because they’re

00:58:24.264 –> 00:58:27.564
like they even sleep with their doors unlocked to their house and they’re like

00:58:27.564 –> 00:58:33.744
what’s going to happen to me here yeah most every case of car break-ins at least

00:58:33.744 –> 00:58:38.904
that I’ve known about here around me are directly due to people leaving their

00:58:38.904 –> 00:58:42.984
car doors unlocked like to me it’s a no-brainer right or,

00:58:43.704 –> 00:58:47.164
those even better leaving their keys in their car and their car running and

00:58:47.164 –> 00:58:52.484
then wonder why somebody drives off in it but you know so for me the need is

00:58:52.484 –> 00:58:59.304
apparent and it’s glaringly obvious but to your point is it really solving anybody’s problem and.

00:59:00.540 –> 00:59:05.300
If someone’s not interested in it in the first place, is there a problem to be solved?

00:59:05.980 –> 00:59:10.400
You and I know that there is, right? I mean, I think we both agree that personal

00:59:10.400 –> 00:59:15.600
safety is important and you should at least have the so-called soft skills versus

00:59:15.600 –> 00:59:17.400
the physical, if nothing else.

00:59:18.180 –> 00:59:22.200
But what is the problem we’re trying to solve if that’s the angle to take?

00:59:22.200 –> 00:59:26.500
So I do have an answer for you, but before I go there, I want to address something

00:59:26.500 –> 00:59:30.520
else you said, which was about, and I see this all the time from my local PD.

00:59:30.780 –> 00:59:35.340
It’s like, yeah, car break-ins are up and 90% of them are car doors were left

00:59:35.340 –> 00:59:39.020
unlocked and or stuff open on the seat. Yes. And so.

00:59:39.220 –> 00:59:41.300
Every time. So there’s that aspect.

00:59:41.540 –> 00:59:45.660
And then there’s also the aspect of when I teach asphalt anthropology,

00:59:45.660 –> 00:59:49.160
we break down social versus predatory violence.

00:59:49.740 –> 00:59:55.660
And there’s an officer I follow here. He’s Dion Joseph with LAPD.

00:59:55.800 –> 00:59:57.620
He’s been on Skid Row for about 20 years.

00:59:58.060 –> 01:00:01.340
Amazing human being. If you haven’t read his book, I can’t think of the name

01:00:01.340 –> 01:00:04.220
of it, but if you just Google him, he is unbelievable.

01:00:04.220 –> 01:00:07.500
But he you know frequently puts

01:00:07.500 –> 01:00:10.540
out you know most of the assaults that i see start as

01:00:10.540 –> 01:00:13.240
an argument start out as people you know

01:00:13.240 –> 01:00:17.080
getting into some kind of altercation and then the violence or the robbery escalates

01:00:17.080 –> 01:00:20.680
yeah now sometimes that could be because i get mad at you because you did this

01:00:20.680 –> 01:00:25.480
thing and so we argue or it could be i’m i throw out a hook and i call you maybe

01:00:25.480 –> 01:00:30.900
a slur just to get your goat going and then we argue and then i fire you up rob you yeah.

01:00:31.517 –> 01:00:35.517
Exactly. So he constantly puts out this message that, you know,

01:00:35.657 –> 01:00:41.137
what he sees is, you know, that’s how so many robberies, that’s how so many assaults start.

01:00:41.417 –> 01:00:46.377
So when I was teaching asphalt anthropology at LAPD Community Police Academy,

01:00:46.377 –> 01:00:47.897
I was talking about that.

01:00:48.117 –> 01:00:52.617
And I just made mention of what Officer Joseph said about, oh,

01:00:52.737 –> 01:00:56.497
yeah, he says the majority and there was an officer in the back and he’s nodding.

01:00:56.497 –> 01:01:01.457
And I said, well, what is the majority? Is that like 51%?

01:01:01.697 –> 01:01:05.497
Is that 60%? Like, could I, could I twist your arm and kind of get a number?

01:01:05.757 –> 01:01:08.897
And he’s like, oh, 90%. And my job just dropped.

01:01:09.137 –> 01:01:16.417
And so I feel like a lot of times that if we realize just how simple it is to

01:01:16.417 –> 01:01:21.457
like, just to not get into that argument or just to lock your doors, like, boom,

01:01:21.657 –> 01:01:26.197
like so much crime is just crime of opportunity and just don’t open it up.

01:01:26.497 –> 01:01:31.537
Yeah. That said, I think that and I’d like to drill down on those stats more.

01:01:32.117 –> 01:01:37.457
And I will just like now’s not a time to be like getting stats from L.A.P.D.

01:01:37.557 –> 01:01:40.377
They’re a little busy. We’ll tie it up at the moment. Yeah, I’m curious.

01:01:41.377 –> 01:01:46.277
Yeah. So I’m kind of curious, you know, like I want to lean towards like that

01:01:46.277 –> 01:01:49.417
might be different for different, you know, genders. That might be different

01:01:49.417 –> 01:01:50.557
for different demographics.

01:01:51.197 –> 01:01:56.157
You know, there’s this myth that women don’t get into social arguments and fight.

01:01:56.317 –> 01:01:58.317
That’s not true, but it’s definitely less.

01:01:59.197 –> 01:02:03.177
So I just wanted to point that out that, you know, from the sets that I’m seeing

01:02:03.177 –> 01:02:08.597
from law enforcement is that you can do like the most simple thing and save

01:02:08.597 –> 01:02:10.077
yourself 90% of the grief.

01:02:10.957 –> 01:02:15.897
But to come back to your original question, Jim, which was about the problem we’re trying to solve.

01:02:16.217 –> 01:02:20.817
I think an issue with self-defense in general is that it’s that it’s general.

01:02:21.097 –> 01:02:25.637
Like I want to put on a self-defense class and I want the whole community to

01:02:25.637 –> 01:02:30.957
come or maybe I just want women to come. But it’s just, it’s not specific enough. And…

01:02:31.995 –> 01:02:36.175
And personally, it’s like, what problem? And again, it’s coming back to what

01:02:36.175 –> 01:02:38.535
problem am I solving? What problem am I solving?

01:02:38.675 –> 01:02:41.055
So if I look at data, we’ve talked about data before.

01:02:41.335 –> 01:02:45.735
If I want to serve women, what can I do to serve women?

01:02:45.775 –> 01:02:49.655
If I look at the data, they’re usually assaulted by someone they know.

01:02:50.255 –> 01:02:55.135
A lot of times it’s a domestic violence situation. So maybe teaching them to

01:02:55.135 –> 01:02:58.555
beat up the boogeyman stranger on the street isn’t the answer.

01:02:58.715 –> 01:03:04.255
Maybe the answer, if I want to give back, maybe I go and start a scholarship

01:03:04.255 –> 01:03:09.035
at the local community college so a woman can complete her education and like

01:03:09.035 –> 01:03:12.935
be financially independent and get out on her own. Like maybe that’s self-defense.

01:03:13.695 –> 01:03:19.475
Maybe self-defense, you know, we want to measure self-defense by how many people

01:03:19.475 –> 01:03:22.655
we have in our class, but I don’t know that that’s the right measure.

01:03:22.655 –> 01:03:25.435
You know with this thing got

01:03:25.435 –> 01:03:28.655
under my skin kind of recently there was i think

01:03:28.655 –> 01:03:32.935
brock turner case is the most famous of this where someone did a really horrific

01:03:32.935 –> 01:03:37.355
sexual crime and got like he got three months or whatever he got but more recently

01:03:37.355 –> 01:03:44.155
there was a man in utah who sexually assaulted and drugged people and had videos

01:03:44.155 –> 01:03:48.475
of children being assault like it was just i won’t get into It was just gross.

01:03:49.015 –> 01:03:53.515
And this guy wound up getting, the judge gave him like six months in jail.

01:03:53.795 –> 01:03:58.155
And so you can teach people to punch people in the face all day long.

01:03:58.155 –> 01:04:03.675
But as long as we have a system that looks the other way or just slap somebody on the wrist.

01:04:04.055 –> 01:04:07.955
And so again, I mean, if we really want to protect children,

01:04:08.275 –> 01:04:11.575
okay, what are, and this is not my area, but I’m just going to throw out some

01:04:11.575 –> 01:04:15.675
examples, like children are vulnerable to, you know, being preyed on by the

01:04:15.675 –> 01:04:18.755
internet. Like, okay, like, let’s look at the detail of that.

01:04:18.875 –> 01:04:23.195
And how can I serve? again I feel like and I know this is all well intentioned

01:04:23.195 –> 01:04:27.575
but sometimes we have this hammer and it all looks like a nail and we want to

01:04:27.575 –> 01:04:33.975
we want to solve the problem with our hammer but that’s not necessarily the answer and.

01:04:34.786 –> 01:04:39.906
Again, I want to clarify, I definitely believe in physical training,

01:04:39.906 –> 01:04:42.246
but if you take a physical class with me,

01:04:42.886 –> 01:04:45.986
you’re going to spend, depending on your lifestyle and things like that,

01:04:46.146 –> 01:04:49.606
you’re going to spend just as much time hitting a bag as you are practicing

01:04:49.606 –> 01:04:53.946
getting on a subway with luggage or small children and how do I navigate that? Yeah.

01:04:54.346 –> 01:04:58.666
And so it’s like those practical day to day things.

01:04:58.826 –> 01:05:03.086
It’s like I may not be violently raped on the train, but I could be sitting

01:05:03.086 –> 01:05:05.626
on the train and not paying attention and my bag gets snatched.

01:05:05.906 –> 01:05:09.946
And so those, again, kind of coming back to the mission of Metropolitan Finishing

01:05:09.946 –> 01:05:14.626
School, those are the details that I feel like get left out of what we call

01:05:14.626 –> 01:05:17.466
self-defense training. And I talked to Randy King about this.

01:05:17.606 –> 01:05:19.426
He’s like, I don’t know if what you speak to self-defense.

01:05:19.606 –> 01:05:22.886
And I’m like, you’re right. And I’m not attached to that. I just don’t know what else to call it.

01:05:24.006 –> 01:05:26.226
Well, I think there’s other aspects to it.

01:05:27.386 –> 01:05:33.506
No, there’s just other aspects to it. Yeah. Yeah. I have this debate in my head

01:05:33.506 –> 01:05:37.546
oftentimes, and I’ve asked other people about it and talked with other people about it.

01:05:37.826 –> 01:05:44.346
And I’ll, I don’t know, I’ll make the statement slash maybe there’s a question in the mix somewhere.

01:05:44.346 –> 01:05:53.306
But in my in my mind, I’m of the opinion that self-defense classes are should

01:05:53.306 –> 01:06:00.086
be more as much about information as it is the physical training aspects.

01:06:00.406 –> 01:06:06.066
And dare I say, the information slash education is more important than the physical.

01:06:07.006 –> 01:06:09.806
Would you agree with that?

01:06:11.066 –> 01:06:14.466
Yeah. I mean, I don’t know how to quantify it in terms of numbers.

01:06:14.546 –> 01:06:18.146
And I would hesitate to do that because I think it really kind of depends on

01:06:18.146 –> 01:06:19.386
a person’s circumstances.

01:06:19.726 –> 01:06:25.466
But, you know, if we again, if we look at the data of what leaves people victimized,

01:06:25.526 –> 01:06:28.826
it’s not because they didn’t know how to punch somebody in the face.

01:06:28.826 –> 01:06:33.386
Like maybe they did or didn’t, but, you know, it’s because they got into that,

01:06:33.426 –> 01:06:37.526
you know, argument or they left their cars on their doors unlocked.

01:06:38.186 –> 01:06:41.146
Or alternatively, like I said, in the case of some women I’ve worked with who

01:06:41.146 –> 01:06:44.506
have done all the physical things that they were supposed to do.

01:06:45.912 –> 01:06:49.312
But they didn’t like this, you know, they had had a drink.

01:06:49.512 –> 01:06:52.872
So they’re like they’re they they were a little slow to process what happened. Sure.

01:06:53.052 –> 01:06:56.332
That I’m clearly not blaming them because they drank. I’m just going to be clear

01:06:56.332 –> 01:06:59.132
on that. But it’s just it’s just it’s like, you know, when I have a drink,

01:06:59.192 –> 01:07:00.752
I’m like, oh, wait, what just happened? Right.

01:07:01.092 –> 01:07:05.092
Yeah. And so there’s that fuzziness. You’re wearing you’re wearing different

01:07:05.092 –> 01:07:09.232
clothes. And it’s like it’s not at all like being on the mat in a self-defense

01:07:09.232 –> 01:07:11.872
class or crop environment, that kind of thing.

01:07:12.172 –> 01:07:15.712
So, you know, I don’t want to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

01:07:15.912 –> 01:07:20.472
I think that, you know, the self-defense industry is going through a really

01:07:20.472 –> 01:07:21.972
interesting revolution right now.

01:07:22.112 –> 01:07:26.752
Like it’s, you know, and I’ve kind of followed this path and I’m learning and growing.

01:07:26.912 –> 01:07:29.752
I don’t have the answer, but, you know, it kind of starts out as martial arts.

01:07:30.092 –> 01:07:32.792
And then there’s been voices over the years that have been saying,

01:07:32.912 –> 01:07:35.512
well, martial arts is not self-defense. It’s these other things.

01:07:35.912 –> 01:07:40.032
But I think we need to go even further than that because, you know,

01:07:40.152 –> 01:07:43.892
we have, you know, things that are focusing on self-defense,

01:07:43.892 –> 01:07:47.532
but they’re just physical or they’re coming from the point of view from law

01:07:47.532 –> 01:07:49.132
enforcement, which, you know.

01:07:49.572 –> 01:07:55.852
When, and this is a challenge I ask people, it’s like name five women in self-defense

01:07:55.852 –> 01:07:59.152
period and people can’t do it.

01:07:59.312 –> 01:08:03.472
Right. Like this big name or alternatively like name, name names.

01:08:03.592 –> 01:08:06.972
And it’s like, it’s always like kind of the military law enforcement background,

01:08:07.172 –> 01:08:09.232
which is like completely valuable.

01:08:09.232 –> 01:08:12.332
And I, I really, i’ve trained with folks and

01:08:12.332 –> 01:08:15.092
and i’ve learned so much but you get to

01:08:15.092 –> 01:08:18.892
the edges of that value pretty quickly because they

01:08:18.892 –> 01:08:23.552
don’t know what it’s like to walk down the street and this guy eye you and press

01:08:23.552 –> 01:08:28.592
up on you right like those cat call otherwise that we need to yeah all that

01:08:28.592 –> 01:08:33.872
we need to talk about that and you know that’s i think that need to really shown

01:08:33.872 –> 01:08:38.072
a light on what’s missing in a lot out of the self-defense space.

01:08:38.272 –> 01:08:42.612
And I say shown a light because I don’t mean made wrong or negate,

01:08:42.792 –> 01:08:47.332
not at all, because I also know how the physical stuff has saved people from,

01:08:47.332 –> 01:08:50.792
you know, assaults and harm.

01:08:51.132 –> 01:08:55.472
So, you know, but it’s not about throwing out the baby with the bathwater,

01:08:55.572 –> 01:08:57.232
but it’s like taking it to the next step.

01:08:57.432 –> 01:09:02.912
And when you listen to people and, you know, who spoke up during me too and things that happened,

01:09:03.232 –> 01:09:08.112
we get to see like these awful dynamics You know, it’s this person that’s a

01:09:08.112 –> 01:09:15.372
relative or this person, you know, the older brother’s friend or the boss at work as we get older.

01:09:15.772 –> 01:09:21.612
And so, you know, there’s a lot of people out in space like really working out to address that.

01:09:22.132 –> 01:09:25.372
And, you know, I don’t know if you’re familiar with Marianne Frank.

01:09:25.552 –> 01:09:29.832
She’s a really brilliant lawyer who’s talking about some of that stuff.

01:09:30.192 –> 01:09:34.452
And, you know, there’s people doing great work. And I just feel like I’m over

01:09:34.452 –> 01:09:38.652
in my little corner of the world doing my aspect of it.

01:09:39.672 –> 01:09:42.372
And, you know, that’s the thing. Like, I think,

01:09:43.383 –> 01:09:46.283
self-defense instructors we care about people right that’s

01:09:46.283 –> 01:09:49.383
why we put yeah time and energy and train and

01:09:49.383 –> 01:09:53.223
like and of course it’s disappointing you you create a class and no one comes

01:09:53.223 –> 01:09:58.663
that’s that sucks i’ve been there and at the same time there’s this deep passion

01:09:58.663 –> 01:10:04.243
but we really need to like listen about listening to what people’s needs are

01:10:04.243 –> 01:10:06.543
and not being like i know what’s bad for you,

01:10:07.163 –> 01:10:10.343
need to learn how to do this because that’s

01:10:10.343 –> 01:10:13.243
just not you know it only gets us so far

01:10:13.243 –> 01:10:18.043
and and one of my goals with asphalt is i want to get this information in front

01:10:18.043 –> 01:10:23.763
of people who never walk into a physical self-defense class yeah and i am really

01:10:23.763 –> 01:10:27.743
excited when those are the people that show up you know people maybe with disabilities

01:10:27.743 –> 01:10:32.743
or older people that just makes my day yeah and And, you know,

01:10:32.823 –> 01:10:38.443
that goes back to the point that I was attempting to make is that for me, it seems,

01:10:38.743 –> 01:10:41.963
at least again with all this stuff I have floating in my head,

01:10:42.163 –> 01:10:46.603
it seems the information and the education pieces are just as,

01:10:46.783 –> 01:10:48.583
if not more important than the physical.

01:10:49.023 –> 01:10:55.083
But from my limited experience in teaching and training and teaching Krav and

01:10:55.083 –> 01:11:00.143
whatever else, the problem is, is that the information doesn’t sell.

01:11:00.143 –> 01:11:06.683
Like you can’t get students in to take a two hour seminar and learn about stuff,

01:11:06.683 –> 01:11:12.603
but you can sell a seminar for two hours of physical beating up training and whatever else,

01:11:12.643 –> 01:11:16.263
because the physical training part is the sexy part.

01:11:16.263 –> 01:11:19.943
And just in general terms, the sexy is what sells.

01:11:20.283 –> 01:11:23.703
Like if I told you I was going to give you an informational self-defense seminar

01:11:23.703 –> 01:11:28.543
for two hours, you’d be like, but if I was going to tell you how to do a knife

01:11:28.543 –> 01:11:32.563
disarm and a gun, you know, whatever, and how to get out of a choke,

01:11:32.703 –> 01:11:34.343
you’d be like, Hey, I might check that out.

01:11:34.463 –> 01:11:39.123
That’s cool. The reality of it is a lot of things have gone wrong and likely

01:11:39.123 –> 01:11:42.963
dare say you’ve done a lot of things wrong to get to the point where you’re

01:11:42.963 –> 01:11:45.423
needing those skills in the first place.

01:11:45.423 –> 01:11:49.763
Let’s back up and talk about situational awareness or de-escalation or,

01:11:49.923 –> 01:11:53.123
you know, dare I even say compassion, right? Yeah.

01:11:54.183 –> 01:11:58.963
So I’m going to pick on you for a second because when you describe the two scenarios,

01:11:58.963 –> 01:12:02.183
you talked about the soft skills and then the physical.

01:12:02.483 –> 01:12:07.783
Even in your voice, I could feel excitement about one and about the other.

01:12:08.123 –> 01:12:09.843
I’m excited about the information.

01:12:11.363 –> 01:12:16.143
Okay. Well, I kind of picked it up for the other. And so I apologize for overanalyzing.

01:12:16.263 –> 01:12:18.263
No, no, it’s fine reading, but this is fun.

01:12:18.663 –> 01:12:23.503
But I do, I do feel like it is how we talk about it and how we present it.

01:12:23.643 –> 01:12:27.363
So like maybe what we don’t call it is, you know, a two hour informational,

01:12:27.363 –> 01:12:32.563
but you know, I mean, that’s pretty much what asphalt anthropology is. And it.

01:12:33.850 –> 01:12:40.450
You know, again, I’m trying to fill a particular need of, you know, the community I live in.

01:12:41.050 –> 01:12:44.790
You know, I don’t have an answer for you. I think it’s like in any business,

01:12:45.050 –> 01:12:47.510
again, just kind of thinking about it from a business point of view.

01:12:47.870 –> 01:12:51.890
It’s like you try something and you see what works and you see what doesn’t

01:12:51.890 –> 01:12:53.010
and you keep changing it.

01:12:53.170 –> 01:12:56.710
And like, so if you keep like doing the same thing over and over again,

01:12:56.910 –> 01:12:58.910
that is the definition of insanity.

01:12:59.950 –> 01:13:02.570
But I get it, though. Right. Because we’re passionate. And it’s like,

01:13:02.670 –> 01:13:06.010
I’ve been doing this like you like a long time. And like I said earlier,

01:13:06.110 –> 01:13:07.410
it’s like, it just won’t quit me.

01:13:07.850 –> 01:13:12.270
And, you know, but, but I also have different goals, right?

01:13:12.350 –> 01:13:17.330
Like, I don’t have aspirations to make this my, my full time career.

01:13:17.550 –> 01:13:20.570
I love doing it. And I love having the conversations.

01:13:20.970 –> 01:13:24.230
I love being on Instagram and having those, those conversations.

01:13:25.110 –> 01:13:29.890
But, you know, and maybe, you know, maybe, maybe I’m checking it out and saying,

01:13:29.890 –> 01:13:33.370
like, it’s just too hard. So I’m just going to go with with, you know, the easy.

01:13:33.590 –> 01:13:36.610
But I don’t know. Sometimes I think about it, Jim.

01:13:36.770 –> 01:13:43.210
Sometimes it’s like, you know, nobody wants to like plan their funeral or like buy insurance.

01:13:43.470 –> 01:13:47.590
Those are the dark things. And so it’s like maybe what can we learn from a funeral director?

01:13:47.890 –> 01:13:50.710
Like, look at them. Like, how do they make those free sales?

01:13:51.792 –> 01:13:54.812
But, you know, I and maybe I hate to sound resigned or whatever,

01:13:54.932 –> 01:14:00.292
but I don’t think that like, you know, the self-defense industry as it exists is for everybody.

01:14:00.392 –> 01:14:06.892
And I think it’s our challenge is to figure out how to make it for more people. Yeah, I agree.

01:14:07.212 –> 01:14:12.812
Yeah, absolutely. You know, again, that’s the ongoing puzzle. If we want to get at.

01:14:13.252 –> 01:14:17.352
Yeah. But if we really want to get at what, you know, like I’m serious,

01:14:17.552 –> 01:14:21.672
like maybe what there is to do is to start a scholarship at your local community college.

01:14:21.792 –> 01:14:27.012
And like, even if it’s just enough to pay for books, like maybe that’s, that’s it.

01:14:27.132 –> 01:14:31.592
Or advocating for laws that get differ, you know, punishment for,

01:14:31.752 –> 01:14:33.552
you know, like that guy who got six months.

01:14:33.552 –> 01:14:37.632
Like, you know, we, we, in self-defense, we think it’s just about getting bodies

01:14:37.632 –> 01:14:42.992
in classes, but I, I don’t know that that’s the measure that we should always be using.

01:14:42.992 –> 01:14:48.692
I feel like if you also are kind of out there advocating in a variety of ways,

01:14:48.892 –> 01:14:53.512
people are going to be attracted to you and be like, oh, this guy gets it.

01:14:54.372 –> 01:14:57.732
Yeah. All good points. All good points.

01:14:58.412 –> 01:15:02.772
Is there anything else? Is that too far out for you? I know it’s not the mainstream

01:15:02.772 –> 01:15:04.712
point of view. No, no, no. I don’t.

01:15:05.272 –> 01:15:08.532
It’s not too far out. No, the question is legit.

01:15:08.712 –> 01:15:13.552
Like, I struggle with it all the time. You know, I would like more people to

01:15:13.552 –> 01:15:19.692
take into consideration their personal safety, do something about it,

01:15:19.832 –> 01:15:23.012
and realize it’s their responsibility to do so.

01:15:23.372 –> 01:15:26.712
Do I have the answers on how to make all of that happen?

01:15:26.932 –> 01:15:31.812
No. But that’s why I want to continue to have these sorts of conversations to

01:15:31.812 –> 01:15:36.632
get the perspectives because you do raise some interesting points that not everybody’s talking about.

01:15:36.852 –> 01:15:40.412
Kind of outside the box, right? Yeah. Yeah.

01:15:41.112 –> 01:15:46.752
You know, and you just like, you just like have fun and enjoy with those people that are showing up.

01:15:46.972 –> 01:15:50.772
And like, I don’t know. I just, I don’t really worry about people who aren’t,

01:15:51.459 –> 01:15:55.339
my audience. You know, it’s like, sure, I want everyone to have this information,

01:15:55.339 –> 01:15:59.239
but like, I don’t know, that just sounds so stressful to worry about everybody.

01:15:59.759 –> 01:16:01.099
Maybe I’m lazy. I don’t know.

01:16:01.859 –> 01:16:04.979
Well, you know, it’s like another business adage. Like when you say,

01:16:05.079 –> 01:16:08.859
well, what’s your target audience? And you love getting the response from some

01:16:08.859 –> 01:16:11.919
folks that are like, well, everyone, we want everyone. No, no, no, no, no, no.

01:16:12.319 –> 01:16:16.639
You, you can’t have everyone. You can’t possibly market to everyone.

01:16:16.679 –> 01:16:20.979
You’ve got to have a target audience or at least, you know, maybe a few, Right.

01:16:21.159 –> 01:16:24.039
So what’s your target audience? No, we want to talk to everybody. Okay.

01:16:25.199 –> 01:16:29.759
To your point, maybe it’s just those that are seeking it already.

01:16:29.839 –> 01:16:33.979
And hopefully that, that group will grow over time.

01:16:34.099 –> 01:16:37.719
But in the meantime, you’re talking to those that are interested.

01:16:38.239 –> 01:16:43.519
I don’t know. Yeah, you know, when I ran the martial arts school and we had

01:16:43.519 –> 01:16:46.819
a really solid self-defense program, I mean, it was about,

01:16:47.159 –> 01:16:51.219
we did a lot of partnerships and worked with a lot of like, we worked with the

01:16:51.219 –> 01:16:56.459
schools and the school districts, we worked with like everything from the junior league to Girl Scouts.

01:16:56.459 –> 01:17:00.939
And so it was, you know, really kind of getting out there and doing,

01:17:00.979 –> 01:17:05.099
you know, a lot of free stuff as well as paid to supplement the other.

01:17:06.179 –> 01:17:10.199
And to me, it was about just kind of really being a part of the community.

01:17:10.859 –> 01:17:15.339
More power to the people who are, you know, out there kind of teaching this all over the place.

01:17:16.059 –> 01:17:20.019
My personal preference is to just like be in my community and affect change

01:17:20.019 –> 01:17:26.119
where I can. And, you know, people, you know, where people come from is like

01:17:26.119 –> 01:17:27.719
word of mouth and having a good product.

01:17:28.279 –> 01:17:31.519
And, you know, just kind of going.

01:17:32.559 –> 01:17:37.359
It’s a grind. Like, yeah, just running a martial arts school for seven years.

01:17:37.539 –> 01:17:40.679
I mean, it’s a hustle. Any martial arts instructor.

01:17:40.939 –> 01:17:45.659
It is a grind. I mean, it is what it is. And, you know, just to be smarter business

01:17:45.659 –> 01:17:48.619
people about it and to just kind of keep, you know.

01:17:49.659 –> 01:17:54.559
Adopting. Yeah. So this isn’t meant to put you on the spot.

01:17:54.719 –> 01:17:58.099
I may have done that a couple of times already. I’m just trying to ask questions

01:17:58.099 –> 01:17:59.639
and have the conversation, right?

01:18:00.359 –> 01:18:04.299
We’ve talked about how, you know, one of the failings, and I completely agree,

01:18:04.459 –> 01:18:07.839
one of the failings of typical self-defense training is,

01:18:08.279 –> 01:18:12.439
ooh, let’s have the painter that happens to have the white fan with no windows

01:18:12.439 –> 01:18:16.959
show up on Saturday for the seminar so we can grab you and throw you in the back of it,

01:18:16.959 –> 01:18:21.719
You got to escape and get away because that’s the boogeyman that we’re teaching

01:18:21.719 –> 01:18:24.299
you defense methods to get away from, right?

01:18:25.179 –> 01:18:29.839
But we know that’s not the large percentage of what women have to deal with.

01:18:30.239 –> 01:18:35.159
What is the one thing that you would try to teach in a class for women dealing

01:18:35.159 –> 01:18:37.859
with reality of the situation, right?

01:18:37.959 –> 01:18:40.839
Not the boogeyman jumping out from behind the alley or the bushes,

01:18:40.859 –> 01:18:44.739
but the uncle or the ex-boyfriend or the boss, whatever.

01:18:44.739 –> 01:18:50.039
What’s the one piece of information or self-defense technique,

01:18:50.119 –> 01:18:53.499
either soft skill or physical, that you would give to them?

01:18:55.499 –> 01:19:00.039
Well, that’s a really interesting question because I feel like that’s what I do in asphalt.

01:19:00.399 –> 01:19:04.739
And, you know, if I kind of go back over the outline, there’s like several bullet

01:19:04.739 –> 01:19:08.799
points that, you know, I think are important, right? It’s the myth left being done.

01:19:09.383 –> 01:19:13.303
You know, the mindset, it’s the actual street dodges, like using steel mitt,

01:19:13.723 –> 01:19:15.363
using camouflage, pine corners.

01:19:15.603 –> 01:19:19.363
So there’s like, I feel like I distill a lot of that into asphalt,

01:19:19.363 –> 01:19:24.863
but if you’re going to send me to just like one kind of like.

01:19:25.123 –> 01:19:27.183
One bit of information. Yeah. It would.

01:19:27.763 –> 01:19:31.303
Yeah. And it’s not even like a thing how to do, but it’s the mindset.

01:19:31.303 –> 01:19:33.443
It’s like that you are worth defending.

01:19:34.283 –> 01:19:35.603
Yeah. Yeah.

01:19:36.643 –> 01:19:40.143
That’s a good point. And that’s a good point to end on.

01:19:40.703 –> 01:19:44.383
Beverly, this has been great. How can people find you? How can people reach

01:19:44.383 –> 01:19:48.603
out and sign up for Asphalt? Is that local? Can they take online classes?

01:19:48.983 –> 01:19:51.503
Like how can they get ahold of you and do this stuff?

01:19:52.043 –> 01:19:57.323
Yeah. Yeah. So the best way to get ahold of me, um, you can come to my website. If you Google.

01:19:57.663 –> 01:20:02.083
It’s metrofinishschool.com. And I can send you links if you like,

01:20:02.203 –> 01:20:06.723
or I think you might have them, but that’s my website. You can sign up for alerts.

01:20:06.923 –> 01:20:13.123
I keep a blog, which it tells stories about life and how I kind of dodge stuff.

01:20:13.263 –> 01:20:15.643
Like I’m not kidding. Something seems to happen every week.

01:20:16.523 –> 01:20:22.183
It’s crazy out here, but I’m most, I’m most active on Instagram where I post

01:20:22.183 –> 01:20:28.063
every day. and it’s either something about street dodges, how to avoid trouble, something I saw.

01:20:28.263 –> 01:20:31.423
And sometimes it’s just like really cool street art because as we talked about,

01:20:31.843 –> 01:20:35.703
it’s about really, you know, appreciating the world you’re in,

01:20:35.843 –> 01:20:37.043
not moving through it fearfully.

01:20:37.303 –> 01:20:42.263
So, you know, if you’re looking for something, you know, that’s about moving

01:20:42.263 –> 01:20:45.283
through public spaces that’s not fear-based, I’m your girl.

01:20:46.243 –> 01:20:49.783
And also, if you’re interested in what I’m talking about, I am in the middle

01:20:49.783 –> 01:20:54.523
of a manuscript working on a book that talks about particularly the target audience

01:20:54.523 –> 01:20:56.543
is women taking back public spaces.

01:20:56.923 –> 01:20:59.863
Nice. Not necessarily through a punch in the nose, but we’re not,

01:20:59.923 –> 01:21:01.803
you know, we’re not moving that off the table either.

01:21:02.083 –> 01:21:07.583
Yeah. So, you know, hop on over to my website, sign up. You’ll get alerts on that and my newsletter.

01:21:08.203 –> 01:21:11.943
I just sent it out today. So the July will be the next one.

01:21:12.243 –> 01:21:17.963
But yeah, I love, would love to hear from folks and keep the conversation going. Absolutely.

01:21:18.703 –> 01:21:22.263
Well, we appreciate it. This has been great. and thanks so much for taking time

01:21:22.263 –> 01:21:23.923
out and joining us. Absolutely.

01:21:24.080 –> 01:21:43.992
Music.