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Music.

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Hey, and welcome back to another episode of the Own Guard Solutions Podcast.

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Thanks for listening. Hey, hey, and welcome back. Today I have my guest, David Lashley on.

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David is an accomplished martial artist, a self-defense instructor,

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if I can even talk this afternoon, and bailiff extraordinaire. And how are you, David?

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Good. How are you today, Jim? Good, good. I appreciate you jumping on here with us.

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I think this is going to be a good one. And, you know, I was joking with you,

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at least I hope it came off that way, when we had our initial phone call to

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get this thing kind of put together.

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And I said, it’s official. You’re the first bailiff I’ve ever met in my entire life.

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And so I was talking to a buddy last week about having you on today.

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And I was like, yeah, this cat’s a bailiff. And he says, I’ve never met a bailiff in my entire life.

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And I was like, I know it’s so bizarre. And he said, you know,

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he said, he said, well, you know, there’s more than a couple of them with all

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the courts in the, in the world.

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And I was like, yeah, you would have thought at this point we’d have bumped

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into someone that’s a bailiff, but you’re the first. So congratulations.

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I’m happy to be too.

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So, yeah, I thought before we got started, we could just talk a little bit or

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a lot about you, your background, your history, how you became a bailiff,

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your martial arts background.

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I’m fascinated. You have like, what, five, six black belts, I think, if I remember right.

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Something crazy for sure. And just kind of talk about who you are and your background

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and how you came to be what you are today.

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So when I started training, I kind of started training martial arts probably

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about fourth or fifth grade. And it was Kempo Karate. Okay.

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And that was all we had in our county was one instructor and,

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you know, one type of martial art. And it was a probably a good 30 minute drive

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for my parents, but you know.

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40 some years ago that that was a you know a

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big drive for them and so

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i did it for a couple years and kind of got out

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of it until i graduated and i

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got married and i uh

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i was an athlete through school played the

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sports and stuff and all of a sudden i caught myself i

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put on quite a bit of weight yeah and my

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doctor was pretty blunt and he’s like you know

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you’re way too heavy for like a 24 25

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year old i am not putting you on blood pressure medicine

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you’re gonna you’re gonna exercise and go diet good

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for him yeah and come back and he’s like

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go find something you’ve always wanted to do it cannot

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be golf because you’ll choose a cart if

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you do right so he goes i know you

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won’t walk it so i’m like you know i used to enjoy martial

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arts and i found a karate instructor.

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Now and it was a little bit farther away but i

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could i was driving myself and his name

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was uh georgian arena and george was his

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father and him were really known for their boxing okay but

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they went in that they got really heavy into karate and

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i had george in his later years when i

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trained with him for probably 10 years before it was

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all said and done so it was a

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shotokan style karate but we sparred a

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lot he wasn’t the biggest fan of kata and we

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used our hands a lot because he was a boxer

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at heart yeah so i was i was

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fortunate in that aspect how he’s felt

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and then when i was and i

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was probably just got my black belt real close

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in karate and this little smaller guy say

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because i’m not a big guy but you know 510 at that time i’m

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i’m now like 205 210 yeah and i’m sparring a guy and i’m kind of beating up

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on me he’s another black belt and smaller maybe 135 all of a sudden he he doesn’t

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like it anymore and he oh soda carries me and puts me in an arm bar yeah.

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And i didn’t know how to tap so i started yelling uncle

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i i didn’t know what to

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do i don’t know why that didn’t take off and but

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at that point i was like i have to learn jiu-jitsu yeah

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like judo well this grappling they said it was jiu-jitsu i’m

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like that’s i have to learn this like this that

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was amazing to me sure and then that’s when i got into the more traditional

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jiu-jitsu as a seikon which a japanese style but it was it reminds you a lot

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of like an aikido a lot of those small joint manipulations and stuff. And,

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I just started meeting people, you know, going to different tournaments.

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And one of the guys I was really fortunate to get a train with,

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and his name was John Saylor.

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And John Saylor is probably the most underrated martial artist to judo coach

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and just pioneer of martial arts.

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And he was an Olympian, one of the top Olympian heavyweights back in the 70s.

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And he was one of the top, if not the top heavyweight judo guy in the world in 80.

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But that was a year that we didn’t go to the Olympics. Yep.

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So no one ever got to hear John Saylor because we didn’t go to the Olympics.

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And John then, after that, went into coaching.

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And he was an Olympic judo coach. And I think he was coach of the year in 84, 85 for them.

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But he was a very hardcore trainer. It was old school.

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A lot of his grappling his

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submission style was like that judo base type

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mixed with the judo and he did bare knuckle karate in japan okay so it was like

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a real early time of like me getting to do mixed martial arts at the end of

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the day uh with that but that was probably of all the coaches i have a lot of

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great coaches but he probably left the biggest impression,

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on me just how his training methods and

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he was really good friends with louis simmons at west side barbell and

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just the we would have guys like mike swain

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would come in you know he had just a lot of different guys like

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that would come in so he really opened my eyes to combat

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or combat sports more than anything but

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i was fortunate those last two i talked about i was

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able to get black belts underneath them but when i was training

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shi tai i uh one of the a friend of my he in the the late great casey seabon

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was doing brazilian jiu-jitsu okay and and he introduced me to brazilian jiu-jitsu

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and i was like this i loved it i love just how it flowed and the.

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Smoothness in the transition of that

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and so i i went in that direction

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and was real lucky i mean i

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trained with a lot of great people but at the

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end i’ve spent the last 17 years

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and under vitor liviera five-time world

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champion from gf team and just just

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been incredible all the great athletes they they brought in

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and stuff like that and and in between when i

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travel these gyms i mean i would go to krav maga schools i

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would okay i actually started in the haganoff

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system i did krav maga and that

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was introduced to a guy named daryl truder who did more of

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the haganoff or the fight system all right and in

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israeli base uh martial arts and i

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really i love the simplistic of it and i

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love just how aggressive it was and i i would bounce back and forth so i spent

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most my time with garyl until he he passed away unexpectedly pipe out i just

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by training about four years with him and then i would just like bounce in and

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out of krav magas schools and.

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Anything i could pick up like combat of some i was constantly going because

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that was always the direction i liked i liked the self-defense aspect of things

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i competed i was lucky to you know to do not too bad when i did compete back

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in the day jiu-jitsu karate tournaments did a little MMA and stuff like that.

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But that’s the kind of the basis of like, I’m more, I love the grappling aspect

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of things, but I also like the simplicity of like Krav Maga and some of the

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Israeli martial arts too, that I got a training in.

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Yeah, I enjoyed, I have a little bit of a background in Krav or you may have

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seen or maybe not, but I have a little bit of a background in Krav and I enjoyed it because unlike.

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Traditional martial arts, it sounds like we’ve both been through,

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you know, they are a lot of forms and katas and patterns.

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And the thing, not to sound like a sales pitch to Krav Maga,

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because I don’t want it to be that, and, you know, it has its shortcomings too.

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But the thing at the time that I really, that really got me hooked into Krav

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Maga is unlike the art that I had been doing previously, Krav Maga was primarily

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focused on street self-defense.

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And I know that’s got the whole military sales pitch and all of that in Israel

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and all, all of that good stuff.

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But for me, it was about the self-defense aspects because in that traditional,

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it was a more of a Korean traditional type art.

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It was, it, it had a little bit of self-defense and then they wound up removing

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those pieces ironically.

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So I was pretty ticked off about that because I was hoping they’d actually start

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doing more practical stuff and less worried and focused on the forums and katas.

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So that was kind of how I originally fell in love with Krav is its simplicity

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and its focus on, you know, I guess, quote unquote, real self-defense.

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Oh, yeah. Well, I remember going to early on to one of my first Krav classes.

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And I did a lot of grappling at this point and even some MMA.

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And I’m not like this great athlete by stretch, but I think I have some athleticism to myself.

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Sure. And I get partner up because we’re, we’re two new people in this class

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and I get partnered up with someone maybe, but you can tell they were nervous,

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they’ve never done anything like this. And you know,

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You can just, and I think he even said, I have never, I’ve never played a sport in my life.

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Like this is, I’m doing this to get out of my comfort zone. Yeah.

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And I’m watching, we’re doing just a basic front choke escape and we’re going through all of this.

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And, and the class was maybe 50 minutes and it, you know, they’re pushing us and it was a good sweat.

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And, but then, and we do that stress test and I’m like, man,

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you did pretty good at that. And it really hit me.

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It was like, there is no way I could have spent 50 minutes with this gentleman

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and taught him an armbar or camora.

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I might be able to show him how to do it, but there’s no way I could have showed

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him how to set it up, how to get to it.

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And so I love the grappling arts, but I kind of like tell people, what’s your objective?

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If you’re in it for the long haul, I push people towards the grappling arts.

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If you’re in it for today, I need self-defense right now.

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I’m going on a trip in six, eight, you know, two months.

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Let’s do more of a Krav Maga style. Sure. And you know, the thing that I learned

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about doing Krav the first six months, it took six months and you know, that’s kind of normal,

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but thing that I, that I took away from Krav in that first six months is if

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you want to get in shape and lose weight,

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at least at that time, I think they’ve softened some aspects in some schools.

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But if you wanted to lose weight and get in better shape, give yourself six

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months in a Krav Maga class.

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No, I agree.

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Wear yourself out for sure. So fast forward, you’ve got quite a bit of self-defense

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and martial arts skill set under your belt or training under your belt now.

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How did the bailiff thing come out of that? or did it come out of that?

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Well, it kind of. My brother…

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Was a police officer at the time and he’s like hey there’s a position coming

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open in juvenile court as a probation officer and it was an alternative center

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is what they called it and basically the kids that would act up in the local

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schools they would get like suspended or,

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if they didn’t like expel them they put them in this alternative

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school they was going to go to school regardless yeah and

00:12:54.639 –> 00:12:57.839
they needed someone to basically if

00:12:57.839 –> 00:13:01.379
the kids acted up bothering the teachers you would kind of remove them from

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the classroom and you take them to at the end of the day it’s a timeout area

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yeah and i’m like sure you know because he knew i trained and stuff like that

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so i thought it was a good opportunity maybe you know to get in.

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That’s maybe the area i wanted to go i just wasn’t for sure yeah and i took

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that job and And did it for about a year.

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And in the process, court security position came open at the courthouse.

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But the requirement was at that time, you had to go to 160 hour academy for being a bailiff.

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And a lot of the guys didn’t really want to do that. But to me, it was free education.

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And, you know, just. Why not? Yeah. And sure.

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And I interviewed for it and I was fortunate enough to get it.

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So I went on, did the Bay of Academy.

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I stayed at extra, I got an extra weekend. And because of my training,

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they let me go to an Ohio, the Ohio Peace Officer Training Academy or center center.

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I got their certificate in defensive tactics to

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be able to teach too so so after

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that i mean i i was in down in the front desk for about a year year and a half

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and then the local the bailiff that was there at the time he decided to go back

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home and be a a coach and he took a bailiff position it came open up there so

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i kind of just moved right into it and and been doing it ever since with it.

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And I pretty much knew after the academy, that was the direction I wanted to

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go if I later wanted to be a police officer or something.

00:14:40.393 –> 00:14:44.213
But I was staying in law enforcement at that point of some sort. Sure.

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So backing up just a minute, I meant to ask a minute ago.

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So all of your martial arts background and experience,

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did you do all of that in Ohio or around

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where you were or was it across multiple places

00:14:59.173 –> 00:15:02.233
it was multiple but it was basically

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ohio i’m about an hour north of

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columbus okay and that’s where i

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spent a lot of time and i would travel and if if

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there was a seminar of people coming in

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like even some of the like israeli commandos i would

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try to to know make it a point to go that weekend

00:15:21.133 –> 00:15:24.273
my wife knows that when we

00:15:24.273 –> 00:15:28.013
plan a vacation she’s been married to me for 32 two years she

00:15:28.013 –> 00:15:31.273
knows there’s going to be a gym somewhere squeezing in

00:15:31.273 –> 00:15:38.233
something yeah if it’s a crowd class jujitsu class or even a boxing class or

00:15:38.233 –> 00:15:41.693
something i’m i’m going to do something yeah because i like i still like to

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learn i want to see how they do things yeah absolutely and it never hurts to

00:15:46.133 –> 00:15:50.833
drop in class and just work on some fundamentals because those never you know It never gets old,

00:15:50.853 –> 00:15:54.813
and you never get too good at the basics. No.

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Cool. Yeah, quite an impressive background. And yeah, our first bailiff.

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So I thought there was a couple of interesting topics, and I don’t know how far we’ll get today.

00:16:08.133 –> 00:16:13.453
But one that was intriguing is some key takeaways. As being a bailiff,

00:16:13.673 –> 00:16:18.733
you’ve pulled together some key takeaways from judicial security that can be

00:16:18.733 –> 00:16:22.473
applied to the average Joe, the civilian on the street.

00:16:22.913 –> 00:16:26.033
So we want to talk with that. We want to start there first.

00:16:27.153 –> 00:16:30.973
Yeah. So no different. Ike.

00:16:32.377 –> 00:16:35.637
I would look at how I treat the courthouse.

00:16:35.797 –> 00:16:41.017
It’s not that I treat my house like this, like I have a magnometer in the front.

00:16:42.937 –> 00:16:47.677
Everyone’s got to walk through the front door only. But it’s still the same

00:16:47.677 –> 00:16:50.497
concepts. It’s how do you control your house?

00:16:50.957 –> 00:16:55.217
And it could be from the simple, I mean, I live in the country.

00:16:55.217 –> 00:16:58.197
A lot of people live in the suburbs.

00:16:58.897 –> 00:17:01.937
Something as simple as like, just lock your doors.

00:17:02.377 –> 00:17:09.217
And a lot of people still don’t do that or they get, it is, because I hear it in court.

00:17:09.857 –> 00:17:16.217
How many times I’ve heard somebody, B&E, in the report, the door’s not kicked

00:17:16.217 –> 00:17:17.597
in. It has opened it. Yeah.

00:17:17.857 –> 00:17:20.597
Not really a B&E, is it? Yeah.

00:17:21.517 –> 00:17:27.357
So I think you just, you start like, like I would a day, how do you control

00:17:27.357 –> 00:17:31.477
your environment and, and looking at the safety things and you,

00:17:31.537 –> 00:17:33.337
you know, you can use like technology too.

00:17:33.557 –> 00:17:37.357
I’m for alarm systems, just like I would every day we have in the court and

00:17:37.357 –> 00:17:43.117
cameras. And that’s however you, you know, how far you want to take it with that.

00:17:43.617 –> 00:17:50.777
And I like to think about like, like, as you keep going through like those aspects,

00:17:50.977 –> 00:17:54.377
even if it’s like out and about is the situational awareness.

00:17:54.817 –> 00:17:58.777
Like when I sit in a courtroom, I, I’m constantly scanning.

00:17:58.777 –> 00:18:01.717
It’s trying to read

00:18:01.717 –> 00:18:05.177
not just the people who have committed the crimes it’s

00:18:05.177 –> 00:18:08.717
probably just as much as the the victims because

00:18:08.717 –> 00:18:15.377
they’re the ones it’s you know they’re upset obviously yeah and so you you start

00:18:15.377 –> 00:18:21.837
you’re scanning your area your crowd and just paying attention to maybe something

00:18:21.837 –> 00:18:26.237
that’s a little bit out of the ordinary and a lot of the stuff we we’ve heard plenty of times before.

00:18:27.217 –> 00:18:30.457
But sometimes like for me what i look for when

00:18:30.457 –> 00:18:33.457
i’m standing in a crowd inside the courtroom i’m looking at

00:18:33.457 –> 00:18:36.497
the quiet guy as much as i think the guy

00:18:36.497 –> 00:18:39.977
the obvious sides of the clenched fist yeah posturing up

00:18:39.977 –> 00:18:43.557
raising but the guy who’s sitting in the back working

00:18:43.557 –> 00:18:47.237
even harder to try not to be noticed yeah he’s

00:18:47.237 –> 00:18:50.097
standing out like a sore thumb at the end of the day and doesn’t probably

00:18:50.097 –> 00:18:53.137
even know it no and so i

00:18:53.137 –> 00:18:58.117
think about simple things like that and if i see a guy constantly staring at

00:18:58.117 –> 00:19:01.617
the door the exit there’s nobody coming in and out yeah it’s different when

00:19:01.617 –> 00:19:04.897
people are coming in and out and you’re people just like to see what’s going

00:19:04.897 –> 00:19:09.357
on but when you see people looking at x or the the door that’s the closest and

00:19:09.357 –> 00:19:10.937
they keep staring and looking back,

00:19:11.677 –> 00:19:14.997
it’s kind of a tell sign that maybe they’re up to something or they’re about

00:19:14.997 –> 00:19:17.437
ready to do something and they need to get out quickly.

00:19:18.317 –> 00:19:19.657
Yeah. So, yeah.

00:19:20.773 –> 00:19:24.573
I use a lot of the things like that, like I do it every day,

00:19:24.593 –> 00:19:31.573
like I do at work. I just bring them out and it’s to me because a second nature,

00:19:31.733 –> 00:19:33.913
it’s not, you know, much different.

00:19:34.213 –> 00:19:39.853
I, I don’t sit around thinking about worst case scenarios all the time,

00:19:39.993 –> 00:19:43.073
you know, especially being in my home or something. But I do think,

00:19:43.273 –> 00:19:47.093
Hey, are my, do we got curtains in the right spot?

00:19:47.253 –> 00:19:50.353
I mean, why, why, why are the curtains aren’t where they are?

00:19:50.353 –> 00:19:53.613
Do we why didn’t i turn the bushes yet it’s the fall it’s

00:19:53.613 –> 00:19:56.913
just simple things like we we know but

00:19:56.913 –> 00:20:00.913
because we get distracted easy because we’re so busy and

00:20:00.913 –> 00:20:04.373
i think that’s the biggie more than anything and it’s no different like i do

00:20:04.373 –> 00:20:09.533
at work i i just look for like as you’ve talked about earlier the fundamentals

00:20:09.533 –> 00:20:17.133
of like security i make sure i cover those bases first and then i work my away, kind of out from it.

00:20:17.773 –> 00:20:22.753
Yeah. You know, in all of that, you touch on a lot of great points,

00:20:22.933 –> 00:20:26.453
you know, and one you just mentioned, which I’m sitting here taking notes and,

00:20:26.693 –> 00:20:31.593
you know, the themes that I hear across all of that is we’re not talking about

00:20:31.593 –> 00:20:33.333
spending a lot of money or.

00:20:35.253 –> 00:20:40.773
Being super, super vigilant or paranoid or whatever people sometimes might think of.

00:20:40.773 –> 00:20:45.973
We’re just talking about basic things, like when it comes to situational awareness.

00:20:46.833 –> 00:20:51.573
Looking for and focusing not on everything all at once, but looking for those

00:20:51.573 –> 00:20:55.693
anomalies, the things that aren’t normal, the things that stand out as being

00:20:55.693 –> 00:20:58.573
odd, you know, and listening to your gut, too.

00:20:58.713 –> 00:21:03.253
Guys have instincts as well, especially if you’re trained in the space or you

00:21:03.253 –> 00:21:05.953
do it for a living, you know, like you are.

00:21:06.513 –> 00:21:10.833
You’re looking for those, those anomalies in the space.

00:21:10.993 –> 00:21:15.533
And so, you know, it kind of, and I think we tend to lump all of it in together

00:21:15.533 –> 00:21:21.093
under the umbrella of situational awareness, but you’re really talking about, in this case,

00:21:21.293 –> 00:21:26.593
a lot of being aware of and paying attention to behavioral things too, right?

00:21:26.733 –> 00:21:31.273
Behavioral awareness, environmental awareness, those sorts of things. It’s just as important.

00:21:32.113 –> 00:21:36.633
And so, yeah, focused on the basics. And then, you know, I don’t think that

00:21:36.633 –> 00:21:41.513
we can talk too much about that because, again, like we joke, we giggle about it.

00:21:41.713 –> 00:21:48.053
But I’m blown away, David, sometimes by the number of folks that still don’t

00:21:48.053 –> 00:21:49.393
lock their doors at night.

00:21:49.693 –> 00:21:53.653
I could tell you some stories. And, you know, talking about B&Es that weren’t

00:21:53.653 –> 00:21:58.973
really B&Es, how about all the auto thefts that weren’t breaking into vehicles?

00:21:58.973 –> 00:22:03.373
All they had to do is jiggle the door handle and see if the thing’s unlocked.

00:22:03.373 –> 00:22:06.393
And then everybody’s leaving all their valuables out on the front seat,

00:22:06.473 –> 00:22:07.453
you know, or whatever it is.

00:22:07.573 –> 00:22:12.833
So it’s like, just take away, just square away the basic stuff for you and your family first.

00:22:13.753 –> 00:22:19.113
No i agree and i think sometimes what happens and like you i know you’ve heard this before,

00:22:19.913 –> 00:22:23.133
complacency kills yes and at the

00:22:23.133 –> 00:22:25.853
end of the day when we’re talking not so much in

00:22:25.853 –> 00:22:30.653
the court setting or in a law enforcement say complacency for us every day is

00:22:30.653 –> 00:22:36.733
our comfort and the more comfortable you get the more you you get relaxed on

00:22:36.733 –> 00:22:41.473
doing those things and you you get so focused Especially if you’re in a comfortable

00:22:41.473 –> 00:22:44.053
area where there’s, you don’t think about crime,

00:22:44.273 –> 00:22:47.813
you don’t hear about somebody getting broken into.

00:22:48.033 –> 00:22:52.173
And it’s so easy. And you throw a cell phone on top of that to distract you

00:22:52.173 –> 00:22:56.573
before you know it. And see, in the court, I don’t.

00:22:57.304 –> 00:23:00.904
We take your cell phone when you come into court. We take away all the,

00:23:01.024 –> 00:23:04.804
we have your undivided attention when you come into the courtroom.

00:23:05.564 –> 00:23:12.584
As it should be. Yes. And because no matter, no matter what the emergency is,

00:23:12.644 –> 00:23:16.864
it doesn’t mean we won’t let you leave if you have that emergency, obviously.

00:23:17.464 –> 00:23:20.324
But there’s nothing you can do about right then anyways. Yeah.

00:23:21.084 –> 00:23:25.384
Especially you’re, you’re in a middle of a hearing with that.

00:23:25.384 –> 00:23:27.884
So a little inconvenient.

00:23:28.544 –> 00:23:30.044
Yeah. Yeah.

00:23:31.404 –> 00:23:36.204
Yeah. Yeah. I think those are all excellent points and it’s a reminder to take

00:23:36.204 –> 00:23:40.204
care of those base, those basics, the simple, simplest things,

00:23:40.384 –> 00:23:43.184
lock your doors, get some good lighting around the place.

00:23:43.184 –> 00:23:46.364
To your point, trimming the hedges back off the house, you know,

00:23:46.444 –> 00:23:51.064
the cut back on hiding places and paying attention to your surroundings,

00:23:51.084 –> 00:23:54.864
especially when you’re in the mix with a bunch of perfectly good strangers.

00:23:55.144 –> 00:24:01.264
And I think, you know, you touched on another good point that seems subtle,

00:24:01.284 –> 00:24:05.784
but in your space, it’s even, you know, maybe not so subtle.

00:24:05.964 –> 00:24:08.904
But what I’m trying to say is is that sometimes it’s

00:24:08.904 –> 00:24:12.064
not about focusing on the quote-unquote bad

00:24:12.064 –> 00:24:14.844
guy or the ones that you think are the bad guy or you

00:24:14.844 –> 00:24:17.884
know they’re bad guys sometimes it’s the

00:24:17.884 –> 00:24:24.884
really pissed off angry or upset good guy that might even be more trouble for

00:24:24.884 –> 00:24:30.784
you at the end of the day yeah well usually and i learned this early on i mean

00:24:30.784 –> 00:24:36.944
i’m not saying this is the golden rule but a part of my life i I, for about three,

00:24:37.244 –> 00:24:39.564
three and a half years, I did bouncing on the side.

00:24:40.664 –> 00:24:47.404
And got to learn a lot, but they told me on day one, the guys that come up and

00:24:47.404 –> 00:24:51.784
introduced themselves and thank you for keeping them safe and shake your hands

00:24:51.784 –> 00:24:53.144
are the ones you’re going to take out.

00:24:53.364 –> 00:25:00.244
At some point. And yeah, and boy, I, I know that was in the high 70%.

00:25:00.244 –> 00:25:03.804
Those are the guys that gave us the most trouble.

00:25:04.884 –> 00:25:08.984
And I never would have thought that because one, they’re still sober at that point.

00:25:09.124 –> 00:25:15.064
But that’s just, you don’t realize that’s a habit they have or what they have

00:25:15.064 –> 00:25:19.244
or their subconscious is like preparing for. They know they’re going to get rowdy that night.

00:25:19.424 –> 00:25:23.304
Yeah. It’s like they want you to, they’re making it a point to make you think

00:25:23.304 –> 00:25:27.264
they’re a good guy, knowing that they’re likely going to be the troublemaker

00:25:27.264 –> 00:25:29.124
before the evening’s over with. Yeah.

00:25:29.504 –> 00:25:34.464
Yeah. And, and that’s no different, like in court, sometimes just the same.

00:25:34.564 –> 00:25:39.444
I mean, you, you prepare cause I mean, usually the.

00:25:39.957 –> 00:25:43.197
The trouble we have the most that we have to watch for, I should say,

00:25:43.297 –> 00:25:50.577
prepare for is when you have, it’s not really the defendant and the victim at that point.

00:25:50.757 –> 00:25:55.357
It’s usually defendant’s family and the victim or their family in there.

00:25:55.497 –> 00:25:59.417
And that’s usually what we watch for and try to keep separating.

00:25:59.457 –> 00:26:04.657
And I really, I mean, I specifically, because no different, like a crowd,

00:26:04.777 –> 00:26:09.277
if you’re out in a crowd in public, people, groups will treat you like a pack.

00:26:09.277 –> 00:26:11.897
There’s four or five that they’re not just going to all come at you in

00:26:11.897 –> 00:26:14.597
the front they’re going to circle you yeah they’re going

00:26:14.597 –> 00:26:18.277
to and they’re no different i like in court i specific designate

00:26:18.277 –> 00:26:21.157
one half of the room for a defendant one half

00:26:21.157 –> 00:26:24.317
room for victim because early on i learned real quick

00:26:24.317 –> 00:26:27.117
whoever has the biggest group tries to circle

00:26:27.117 –> 00:26:30.657
the other and and i

00:26:30.657 –> 00:26:34.457
i learned that real fast you you have to keep them separated so

00:26:34.457 –> 00:26:37.537
you can keep you know everything organized and get them

00:26:37.537 –> 00:26:40.717
moving if you have to right i i

00:26:40.717 –> 00:26:43.777
hate to say it but it’s it would be an overlook

00:26:43.777 –> 00:26:47.097
not to point out and remind folks that

00:26:47.097 –> 00:26:54.837
humans at the simplest form are animals too and in groups it can get to be even

00:26:54.837 –> 00:27:00.857
worse right yeah i was just about to ask you to if and i know people kind of

00:27:00.857 –> 00:27:06.257
come in and out and sit where they want to but i was just going to ask if in courts it’s generally.

00:27:07.197 –> 00:27:11.777
The procedure, the practice to kind of divide and keep everybody separated,

00:27:11.777 –> 00:27:15.777
or if it’s just anything goes and we’ll deal with it if it happens.

00:27:15.977 –> 00:27:19.477
But it sounds like you guys stay on top of that, which makes sense.

00:27:19.957 –> 00:27:24.317
Yeah, my practice is I cannot gather enough information.

00:27:24.797 –> 00:27:28.877
I mean, when people come through, I ask their names. I ask them specifically

00:27:28.877 –> 00:27:29.997
who they’re there to see.

00:27:30.357 –> 00:27:34.777
It gives me an idea. I’ll talk to the victim advocate. I’ll talk to deputies,

00:27:34.777 –> 00:27:38.017
different and they’ll give me information about if there’s

00:27:38.017 –> 00:27:40.697
been an issue or something like that or something more to

00:27:40.697 –> 00:27:45.837
look for but the more information i have and i will do my best to keep everybody

00:27:45.837 –> 00:27:53.837
separated and if i have to talk to somebody for whatever reason i do my best

00:27:53.837 –> 00:28:00.377
never to do it inside the courtroom and try to take them out away from people i found out real quick.

00:28:01.757 –> 00:28:05.417
That people either get embarrassed in front of a group or they want to entertain

00:28:05.417 –> 00:28:07.877
a group. And so if you take…

00:28:08.837 –> 00:28:13.457
The group away from them, then you don’t have to, it eliminates a lot more issues.

00:28:13.697 –> 00:28:18.397
And if I can get them walking and talking at the same time, if they are upset,

00:28:18.717 –> 00:28:21.277
it seems to set them down a little bit better.

00:28:21.837 –> 00:28:26.497
And I’m taking them away from where maybe they could hurt somebody at the same

00:28:26.497 –> 00:28:29.597
time. So it’s like a win-win for all of it. Yeah.

00:28:30.077 –> 00:28:37.837
And isn’t, you know, isn’t one of the number one rules, or at least in some

00:28:37.837 –> 00:28:41.077
circles, they promote it for bouncers.

00:28:41.397 –> 00:28:47.377
Isn’t one of the top strategies for dealing with shenanigans is to get the individual

00:28:47.377 –> 00:28:51.757
outside and away from their little crowds?

00:28:52.637 –> 00:28:55.757
Crowds, and you don’t want to hurt any innocent bystanders.

00:28:56.677 –> 00:29:01.337
Between the both, I mean, it’s just your best, and you don’t know how people

00:29:01.337 –> 00:29:06.077
are going to respond in front of a crowd. I mean, I, I literally I’ve had,

00:29:06.197 –> 00:29:10.097
I can tell it’s, it’s just for entertainment. We got cameras there.

00:29:10.277 –> 00:29:12.857
We have press there, there.

00:29:13.545 –> 00:29:19.205
They want attention. Yeah, showboating. Yes. So if you eliminate that beforehand,

00:29:19.545 –> 00:29:24.065
or the other usually, like I said, is they’re embarrassed.

00:29:24.345 –> 00:29:27.625
Yeah. Like they’ve been outed in front of a group of people who probably don’t

00:29:27.625 –> 00:29:29.885
even know them, but they don’t think that.

00:29:30.285 –> 00:29:33.845
Yeah. It’s amazing how some people think, how they operate.

00:29:34.025 –> 00:29:39.805
And I’m sure there’s vengeance and ego involved all up in there at points,

00:29:39.965 –> 00:29:42.185
too, which never helps. No.

00:29:43.225 –> 00:29:48.345
I got a real quick question before circling back on that topic in general.

00:29:48.585 –> 00:29:51.945
And it’s a dumb question, if you believe there’s dumb questions.

00:29:52.085 –> 00:29:54.165
I think I already know the answer to this.

00:29:54.825 –> 00:29:57.725
And of course, someone like you probably doesn’t have to worry about it too

00:29:57.725 –> 00:30:01.585
much anyway. But are bailiffs allowed to carry firearms in the courtroom?

00:30:02.465 –> 00:30:06.985
Yes. I, I’m actually a certified to carry.

00:30:07.165 –> 00:30:12.025
I carry a Glock 45 and I can carry a taser, pepper spray.

00:30:12.285 –> 00:30:16.165
You got the same, you got the same. Okay, cool. I was, I was curious.

00:30:16.305 –> 00:30:20.465
It was like, to me, it would make sense that you of all people would be allowed

00:30:20.465 –> 00:30:22.865
to, but I’ve never had the opportunity to ask.

00:30:23.085 –> 00:30:27.885
But I’ll give you something. And interesting though, as there is a time,

00:30:27.885 –> 00:30:32.385
If we know that we could have a possible situation.

00:30:33.025 –> 00:30:39.425
Like they’ve acted up others, and I know that I have four or five officers already

00:30:39.425 –> 00:30:46.845
in there, I will not carry a gun that day because they know I’m the first guy in to handle it.

00:30:46.845 –> 00:30:49.965
Because there’s why cause extra

00:30:49.965 –> 00:30:52.865
havoc for some reason if they would you

00:30:52.865 –> 00:30:55.665
know get my firearm that way every the guys

00:30:55.665 –> 00:30:58.465
around me know that they don’t have to worry about it

00:30:58.465 –> 00:31:03.505
yeah and and i don’t really need at that point that much firepower right inside

00:31:03.505 –> 00:31:08.945
of a courtroom yeah sure absolutely anything else that might be good advice

00:31:08.945 –> 00:31:15.565
from the courtroom to the street and i would say one that But if it’s helped

00:31:15.565 –> 00:31:18.105
me more than about any of them,

00:31:18.465 –> 00:31:27.065
especially the older I got, is the thing that the courtroom has taught me because of press,

00:31:27.345 –> 00:31:33.525
because of all the people watching you, is to stay professional under pressure.

00:31:34.818 –> 00:31:39.458
Keeping your composure, saying the right things.

00:31:40.058 –> 00:31:46.818
I do my best. I’m really conscious of my language. When you get mad, a lot of people aren’t.

00:31:47.518 –> 00:31:55.218
And I think over time, that has helped outside when you have a tendency to maybe

00:31:55.218 –> 00:32:02.058
let things go or act a little bit different when you’re presented maybe somebody about something.

00:32:02.058 –> 00:32:06.358
And, and I also give jujitsu, I, that’s probably the biggest lessons I think

00:32:06.358 –> 00:32:11.638
I taught, I got from jujitsu is how to feel comfortable being uncomfortable

00:32:11.638 –> 00:32:16.058
because you get smashed a lot when you start. Yeah.

00:32:16.518 –> 00:32:22.538
Yeah. But it’s a big, it’s just being professional under pressure as best you can.

00:32:22.698 –> 00:32:27.098
I think it, you know, translate big when you have to use it outside.

00:32:27.098 –> 00:32:31.198
And I can imagine, you know, I think being professional is a key takeaway,

00:32:31.458 –> 00:32:34.458
even when it’s not a professional situation.

00:32:34.738 –> 00:32:39.678
I think being professional is a good motto to have in that sort of situation.

00:32:39.678 –> 00:32:46.038
But what comes to mind, too, that oftentimes or a lot of times gets overlooked

00:32:46.038 –> 00:32:50.018
or downplayed because it’s not as sexy or maybe it doesn’t bring in the money

00:32:50.018 –> 00:32:55.858
to schools or whatever is the soft skills on the self-defense and, you know,

00:32:56.098 –> 00:32:59.778
self-protection side of things, personal safety, however you want to categorize it.

00:32:59.898 –> 00:33:04.298
And that’s things like what comes to mind as you were talking there is I bet

00:33:04.298 –> 00:33:07.758
you have the opportunity for a lot of verbal de-escalation, do you not?

00:33:07.758 –> 00:33:12.898
And that is a very, very key, important soft skill to bring into the table,

00:33:13.038 –> 00:33:15.358
too, in addition to things like situational awareness.

00:33:15.898 –> 00:33:20.678
Oh, yeah. And I think it’s key to it. I mean, probably at the end of the day,

00:33:20.738 –> 00:33:23.138
the three biggies when you talk awareness awareness.

00:33:23.988 –> 00:33:28.568
Trusting your God to escalate. Those are really the three biggies that probably

00:33:28.568 –> 00:33:30.648
isn’t, there should be more time spent on it.

00:33:30.748 –> 00:33:36.368
But like you said, it’s not as sexy as getting to do all the techniques and gun disarms.

00:33:36.908 –> 00:33:41.168
That’s right. That’s right. And fighting your way out of the back of a white

00:33:41.168 –> 00:33:45.048
windowless van too, because that’s super cool versus telling you how to stay

00:33:45.048 –> 00:33:47.708
chill and be professional and talk your way out of something.

00:33:48.128 –> 00:33:51.768
And I can tell you if something goes wrong in the courtroom,

00:33:51.948 –> 00:33:55.568
like if I actually have an incident and that’s when I’m going wrong.

00:33:56.048 –> 00:33:58.308
I’ve taken care of it. I take them out.

00:33:58.468 –> 00:34:02.328
Everything’s like, and everybody else’s eyes, that was as good as it could get,

00:34:02.548 –> 00:34:05.428
but not in my eyes. What, what did I miss?

00:34:05.888 –> 00:34:10.148
What did I, wasn’t, I am not prepared for what questions did I not ask somebody

00:34:10.148 –> 00:34:15.768
at an officer or a probation officer to make sure that this didn’t happen?

00:34:15.948 –> 00:34:18.868
What didn’t I not see when I scanned that maybe

00:34:18.868 –> 00:34:21.728
prevent that so i take it real personal even though

00:34:21.728 –> 00:34:24.788
everybody thinks it was great and we we got

00:34:24.788 –> 00:34:28.408
to move you know the court never was stopped we kept moving took

00:34:28.408 –> 00:34:31.348
care of this situation but i beat myself

00:34:31.348 –> 00:34:34.148
up a little bit because i i knew i i always think there’s

00:34:34.148 –> 00:34:37.328
something that could have been done to prevent even that

00:34:37.328 –> 00:34:40.128
altercation yeah it’s missed opportunities right

00:34:40.128 –> 00:34:43.428
and you know that makes you better better at

00:34:43.428 –> 00:34:46.228
your job and a better person for it because you are so hard on

00:34:46.228 –> 00:34:49.028
yourself everybody thinks you did a great job you

00:34:49.028 –> 00:34:52.148
know you may have i mean not everybody catches everything

00:34:52.148 –> 00:34:55.448
anyway but you you may have had some missed opportunities

00:34:55.448 –> 00:35:00.508
that will make you better prepared for the next incident hopefully there’s not

00:35:00.508 –> 00:35:04.688
any but you know we know how the world works or likely will be can you handle

00:35:04.688 –> 00:35:08.748
that one even better the next time and then over time you’ve gotten to be as

00:35:08.748 –> 00:35:13.328
good at your role as you are and then more importantly in the role is that leadership,

00:35:13.968 –> 00:35:18.048
recognizes that David’s doing a damn good job, and this is one of the reasons

00:35:18.048 –> 00:35:22.168
why he does such a good job is because he cares enough to think through this stuff.

00:35:23.168 –> 00:35:28.068
I just think it’s important. You have to always self-analyze. Yeah.

00:35:28.751 –> 00:35:32.331
Yeah, it’s a form of learning, right? Like we should always be learning.

00:35:32.551 –> 00:35:36.671
And I read it somewhere recently and you and I may have talked about it,

00:35:36.871 –> 00:35:39.831
but I heard the term or I read the term micro learning.

00:35:40.211 –> 00:35:43.871
And I feel like you don’t have to go to classes, big classes,

00:35:44.171 –> 00:35:46.571
big schools and take some huge initiative.

00:35:47.131 –> 00:35:50.331
Just read or watch videos or whatever it is, a little webinar,

00:35:50.471 –> 00:35:53.731
hour long webinar here or there and micro learn along the way.

00:35:53.811 –> 00:35:57.731
And you’d be surprised how many tips and tricks you can pick up just from micro

00:35:57.731 –> 00:36:01.071
learning. I really did latch on to that terminology. I don’t know why,

00:36:01.151 –> 00:36:04.891
but it seems to fit what I try to do. No, it sounds good.

00:36:05.071 –> 00:36:07.811
Yeah, I think that’s a great way to say it.

00:36:07.991 –> 00:36:11.971
Yeah, I wish I could remember where I saw that. I think I read it somewhere,

00:36:11.971 –> 00:36:13.031
and I was like, that’s brilliant.

00:36:13.191 –> 00:36:17.191
That’s exactly what you should be doing all the time. Oh, I agree.

00:36:18.131 –> 00:36:22.851
I wanted to talk about this other topic that I thought stood out,

00:36:22.891 –> 00:36:25.411
and I think the courtroom to street certainly does.

00:36:25.411 –> 00:36:29.551
But talking about, because I don’t think there’s near enough of it,

00:36:29.631 –> 00:36:33.571
which is why one of the reasons why I wanted to talk about it is strategies

00:36:33.571 –> 00:36:38.071
that businesses can implement to reduce violence and improve security.

00:36:38.071 –> 00:36:44.591
And, you know, in my limited exposure in attempting to work with corporations,

00:36:44.591 –> 00:36:49.411
even that I’ve worked for to do more about that,

00:36:49.671 –> 00:36:55.131
they seem reluctant to because it makes everybody uneasy.

00:36:55.751 –> 00:37:01.131
Maybe they don’t feel like they have anybody qualified to talk about it with them.

00:37:01.391 –> 00:37:05.571
And then they also, I think like a lot of schools, at least in the past,

00:37:05.791 –> 00:37:09.411
have this philosophy or mentality, this mindset, whatever it is,

00:37:09.511 –> 00:37:15.371
that if we address it, that means we acknowledge that it is happening or could

00:37:15.371 –> 00:37:17.531
happen and we don’t want to scare everybody.

00:37:18.491 –> 00:37:21.311
But I think it’s important that businesses…

00:37:22.657 –> 00:37:27.237
Understand that they do have a responsibility to their employees to give them

00:37:27.237 –> 00:37:31.257
as safe of an environment as they can. I mean, they have fire warden programs.

00:37:31.457 –> 00:37:37.857
Why not take that and extend it a bit further, whether it’s active killer or something else?

00:37:38.497 –> 00:37:43.137
Let’s talk a little bit about that and what you think businesses could or should be doing.

00:37:44.697 –> 00:37:50.137
Especially, I mean, we’re seeing more and more in the news with the workplace

00:37:50.137 –> 00:37:54.337
violence and the active killer situations and stuff like that.

00:37:54.517 –> 00:38:01.637
So yeah, some of the things I think they should think about is like empower

00:38:01.637 –> 00:38:03.237
the employees a little bit.

00:38:03.437 –> 00:38:09.097
Give them some options or some ways to speak up if something isn’t right.

00:38:09.257 –> 00:38:14.157
It doesn’t mean they’re telling on somebody, but if they see another employee

00:38:14.157 –> 00:38:18.917
or the coworker, I should say, not acting right or something seems off or they

00:38:18.917 –> 00:38:22.857
said something, you know, all the true tell signs that they tell us to watch for.

00:38:23.077 –> 00:38:28.337
Like when you, you don’t give like maybe the employees an opportunity or an

00:38:28.337 –> 00:38:35.517
easy way to speak up about it and, and try to, in a way that they truly feel

00:38:35.517 –> 00:38:37.317
that it’s going to be confidential.

00:38:37.937 –> 00:38:42.337
So if there isn’t something that comes out of it, that didn’t have to worry

00:38:42.337 –> 00:38:48.537
about that coworker finding out or maybe, you know, trying to get back at them or something like that.

00:38:48.617 –> 00:38:55.577
So I think that’s a why is just a big part of it is showing them just ways to

00:38:55.577 –> 00:39:01.417
report things that’s maybe a little bit more, you know, confidential than anything.

00:39:01.417 –> 00:39:04.597
Or it could be maybe there’s certain times

00:39:04.597 –> 00:39:10.537
that they have certain like people in hr just to talk to or they you know they’re

00:39:10.537 –> 00:39:16.897
they they’re supervisors because a lot of i think a lot of times maybe a lot

00:39:16.897 –> 00:39:21.397
of workers maybe don’t feel as comfortable going to the supervisor yeah and

00:39:21.397 –> 00:39:23.377
so like you have stuff and.

00:39:24.439 –> 00:39:29.159
Set up for them to have other options to go to, even if it’s a phone call,

00:39:29.159 –> 00:39:32.799
instead of have to be in person where you walk into a room and everybody sees

00:39:32.799 –> 00:39:34.099
you walk into a room. Right.

00:39:34.859 –> 00:39:40.139
Like a hotline I could call out in the parking lot or something would be better than that. Yeah.

00:39:40.979 –> 00:39:43.679
You know, I think this stuff like that.

00:39:44.679 –> 00:39:50.219
And then when you start thinking about what type of trainings can I put in,

00:39:50.319 –> 00:39:54.759
like we just talked about awareness and de-escalation trainings and stuff like that.

00:39:54.939 –> 00:40:00.999
And I think that if you start having those more often, and I,

00:40:01.019 –> 00:40:03.919
you know, you make me think like this micro learning, just like that,

00:40:04.079 –> 00:40:05.939
it doesn’t have to be two hours.

00:40:06.219 –> 00:40:10.359
Maybe you’re sending out 15, 10, 15 minute videos through email for everybody

00:40:10.359 –> 00:40:12.299
to watch, answer a couple of questions.

00:40:12.779 –> 00:40:16.019
But those, but during those trainings,

00:40:16.259 –> 00:40:20.219
they’re getting the idea was like also being it’s reinforced if

00:40:20.219 –> 00:40:23.479
you’re seeing these things we need to contact you

00:40:23.479 –> 00:40:26.439
know these ways of letting us know to make sure

00:40:26.439 –> 00:40:30.979
they’re staying ahead of us like it’s a real trying to be a real preventative

00:40:30.979 –> 00:40:37.379
program with that yeah i i have so many thoughts right now running through my

00:40:37.379 –> 00:40:44.899
head after hearing you say that so i for selfish reasons obviously at least at points in my career,

00:40:44.899 –> 00:40:48.839
I’ve gone to the head of security and companies and said, hey,

00:40:48.939 –> 00:40:50.279
could we do this? Can we do that?

00:40:50.379 –> 00:40:53.739
And hey, I’m more than happy to help because I do all this stuff,

00:40:53.879 –> 00:40:55.499
right? Or I have done all this stuff.

00:40:56.499 –> 00:41:02.959
The challenges I think, or I’m pretty certain of, is that even the head of security

00:41:02.959 –> 00:41:04.379
still works for someone.

00:41:04.579 –> 00:41:07.939
And if the attitude of the person that they’re reporting into,

00:41:08.239 –> 00:41:13.359
AKA even the CEO of the company is not on board or doesn’t want to scare folks

00:41:13.359 –> 00:41:17.639
or feels like it’s a taboo subject matter to cover with employees,

00:41:18.079 –> 00:41:21.679
then there’s only so much the head of security can do.

00:41:22.259 –> 00:41:28.519
On the flip side with HR, if you didn’t know, contrary to what some HR departments,

00:41:29.099 –> 00:41:32.379
spend an awful lot of time trying to convince their employees of,

00:41:32.919 –> 00:41:36.119
HR is not there for the employee. They’re there for the company.

00:41:36.539 –> 00:41:41.759
And so it’s kind of sometimes a conflict of interest to go to HR.

00:41:41.979 –> 00:41:48.299
And I know this firsthand and I’ve seen it too, is that ultimately,

00:41:48.859 –> 00:41:52.719
yes, they go through the motions, but ultimately HR works for the company as

00:41:52.719 –> 00:41:53.939
you might expect them to.

00:41:54.219 –> 00:41:59.999
And so how comfortable can people be going to HR with these sensitive subject

00:41:59.999 –> 00:42:04.539
matters, knowing that it may not look good for them, or they may be seen as

00:42:04.539 –> 00:42:08.519
a troublemaker or stirring up issues where there aren’t any, that sort of thing.

00:42:08.659 –> 00:42:12.759
That’s not to say that you’re not going to get through working through HR.

00:42:12.919 –> 00:42:16.139
If HR is fair, they’re going to support you as best they can.

00:42:16.279 –> 00:42:19.799
But ultimately, they’re there for the company. I think.

00:42:20.506 –> 00:42:25.706
Again, for selfish reasons, it seems like the training is a better approach

00:42:25.706 –> 00:42:30.086
because you don’t have to do it intrusively where it takes everybody off the floor.

00:42:30.086 –> 00:42:34.046
If, you know, if it’s a plant or if it’s an office place, you know,

00:42:34.146 –> 00:42:37.326
don’t have to take everybody away from their desk for extended periods of time.

00:42:37.446 –> 00:42:44.986
You know, they send out ad nauseum learning videos on DEI, cyber security,

00:42:45.706 –> 00:42:49.706
not taking bribes from business partners, you know, they are always sending

00:42:49.706 –> 00:42:53.586
those types of videos and information out.

00:42:53.786 –> 00:42:57.726
Why not add something in there about, you know, harassment and,

00:42:57.806 –> 00:43:01.666
you know, harassment’s covered too, but I’m thinking more of the stalkers and

00:43:01.666 –> 00:43:03.186
the potential for violence.

00:43:03.926 –> 00:43:06.806
Exes are not, you know, working in the same place together.

00:43:07.026 –> 00:43:10.786
You know, a lot of those things that don’t get talked about,

00:43:10.946 –> 00:43:15.826
right, are happening very much in the office places too. So I’m wondering if

00:43:15.826 –> 00:43:21.086
the training and that micro learning isn’t a very solid way of going about it.

00:43:21.806 –> 00:43:27.846
Yeah, I mean, it sounds like it would be because you’re just you’re if you have

00:43:27.846 –> 00:43:31.446
enough of those throughout the year and you keep reinforcing,

00:43:31.446 –> 00:43:35.806
you know, those those situations and stuff.

00:43:35.806 –> 00:43:39.506
And what we do,

00:43:39.786 –> 00:43:44.046
I mean, we’re not as active as we should be at times with it,

00:43:44.126 –> 00:43:48.746
but we’re encouraged as a court, and it’s like through all of the courts in

00:43:48.746 –> 00:43:52.306
Ohio, is to have a safety security committee.

00:43:53.166 –> 00:43:56.646
And it’s of different departments. It didn’t have to be in the courthouse.

00:43:57.006 –> 00:44:04.186
But that way, you meet so often and you bounce ideas off, but you address some of those concerns.

00:44:04.866 –> 00:44:09.186
And when you have an outside kind of perspective looking

00:44:09.186 –> 00:44:13.266
is saying hey why are you doing this that why aren’t you doing this this or

00:44:13.266 –> 00:44:19.246
this that or it it kind of it does help with that and it’s it’s actually i think

00:44:19.246 –> 00:44:26.186
it’s one of the standards for ohio of court security is to have a security committee

00:44:26.186 –> 00:44:28.906
no i think it’s great we we talked about it.

00:44:29.526 –> 00:44:32.606
On a very basic level when i was doing some fire

00:44:32.606 –> 00:44:35.426
warden work for a couple of years at a company

00:44:35.426 –> 00:44:38.706
i was working at but again they were reluctant

00:44:38.706 –> 00:44:42.326
to bring in discussion of

00:44:42.326 –> 00:44:46.406
active shooter killer whatever you want to call it because again there was a

00:44:46.406 –> 00:44:51.186
fear of all sorts of things i think people get in their head when reality of

00:44:51.186 –> 00:44:55.386
it is hey we just need to do this right and so some of us took it upon ourselves

00:44:55.386 –> 00:45:00.026
to talk about it and put rough game plans into place, but nothing official.

00:45:00.226 –> 00:45:04.926
But the thing that I do like to your point of training and doing more training,

00:45:05.146 –> 00:45:10.626
even in little bits, is that my thought is over time, it’s going to help reinforce

00:45:10.626 –> 00:45:16.926
the environment being non-tolerant of that and maybe encourage those that would

00:45:16.926 –> 00:45:19.886
otherwise be brazen enough to attempt it,

00:45:20.086 –> 00:45:25.226
at least those internal to the company right to say i better not do that here

00:45:25.226 –> 00:45:29.366
because it’s not going to go over well like there’s some indirect benefit of

00:45:29.366 –> 00:45:33.946
that i feel like too does that make sense yeah it’s like you’re taking a proactive

00:45:33.946 –> 00:45:38.006
approach yeah yeah yeah what you said yeah.

00:45:39.146 –> 00:45:49.466
Okay so training and what else and i in taking this training maybe just a little step farther.

00:45:49.846 –> 00:45:56.166
And I would look to even maybe do some like Daftokiller drills,

00:45:56.386 –> 00:45:58.606
you know, do drills with them.

00:45:59.026 –> 00:46:05.706
And where I think it’s important that you do is get the local first responders involved with you.

00:46:06.166 –> 00:46:09.826
Build a relationship with them. Let them get to see your facility.

00:46:10.006 –> 00:46:15.606
Let them get to be a part of, you know, your management and get to interact with everybody.

00:46:15.826 –> 00:46:21.206
And it’s just, you’re getting them, I think it helps build confidence and,

00:46:21.206 –> 00:46:26.146
and the drill itself, because you have those guys involved and then everybody

00:46:26.146 –> 00:46:29.986
gets to see how they, you know, interact and stuff like that.

00:46:30.326 –> 00:46:36.586
I think it’s just a win-win if you, you have some drills and you get first responders involved. Yeah.

00:46:37.006 –> 00:46:41.926
And you know, that satisfies the folks that don’t think anything’s really true

00:46:41.926 –> 00:46:47.906
or legitimate until something like military or law enforcement gets involved, right?

00:46:48.026 –> 00:46:51.186
Because somehow those guys get like, oh my gosh, look, it’s law enforcement.

00:46:51.326 –> 00:46:54.726
They know everything about personal protection and self-defense.

00:46:54.986 –> 00:46:59.406
Really, they don’t, but it helps, at least not in all cases,

00:46:59.406 –> 00:47:05.186
but it certainly would help with perception and making people feel like, okay, this is legit.

00:47:05.366 –> 00:47:09.966
They’ve got the local first responder community involved with this exercise,

00:47:10.186 –> 00:47:12.746
right? And I think to your point, that could go a long way as well.

00:47:13.226 –> 00:47:18.766
Yeah. And you’re letting the local first responders get familiar with your facility. Yeah.

00:47:19.306 –> 00:47:22.606
Yeah. It’s not going to have to be the first time they come in property.

00:47:22.806 –> 00:47:24.966
Yeah. Yeah. I think it’s a big plus.

00:47:25.871 –> 00:47:30.551
For sure. David, this has been good. How can people find you?

00:47:31.591 –> 00:47:34.611
So the website i usually tell everybody

00:47:34.611 –> 00:47:38.371
is just lashleytrainingcenter.com okay and

00:47:38.371 –> 00:47:42.671
it you know that we’ll have some other links

00:47:42.671 –> 00:47:45.871
on there like i have a lashleyselfdefense.com and

00:47:45.871 –> 00:47:48.811
then like there’s a link to the my book if anybody’s

00:47:48.811 –> 00:47:51.651
interested in eyes wide open which covers a

00:47:51.651 –> 00:47:54.351
lot of stuff that we’ve been talking about and but it’s

00:47:54.351 –> 00:47:57.111
all in lashleytrainingcenter.com is where you’ll find

00:47:57.111 –> 00:47:59.931
all those things and yes you’ve got the

00:47:59.931 –> 00:48:02.731
book how’s that doing it looks like it’s taken off pretty

00:48:02.731 –> 00:48:05.531
good it is it’s done a lot

00:48:05.531 –> 00:48:08.931
better than i thought it would be even one

00:48:08.931 –> 00:48:12.111
day for a couple days roughly i was a amazon

00:48:12.111 –> 00:48:15.171
bestseller for our category nice so

00:48:15.171 –> 00:48:19.111
yeah so i was real happy with that and i’ve i’ve

00:48:19.111 –> 00:48:23.951
had i just i’m shocked in our local community i’ll run into somebody and someone

00:48:23.951 –> 00:48:29.111
like out of nowhere i’ll go well hey you want to sign in my book and that’s

00:48:29.111 –> 00:48:35.311
really new to me i’m doing something like that already a star and didn’t know it.

00:48:37.231 –> 00:48:43.391
That’s awesome yeah it’s been it’s it’s it’s been good and i love when every

00:48:43.391 –> 00:48:44.971
of the reviews of this guy and

00:48:44.971 –> 00:48:49.151
even the people tell me i i love it when they tell me it’s an easy read,

00:48:49.691 –> 00:48:54.191
they they can pick things up and some people said they’ve read it a couple times

00:48:54.191 –> 00:48:58.991
because it was a quick easy read and that was the whole intent yeah i i wanted

00:48:58.991 –> 00:49:04.151
i wanted to keep it like that i wanted people to be able to digest it pretty

00:49:04.151 –> 00:49:06.191
you know quickly and easily and not,

00:49:07.331 –> 00:49:12.091
have to spend a lot of time or have to put it down because it’s like read it

00:49:12.091 –> 00:49:15.731
like they said when you’re trying to work through a fire hose yeah yeah i didn’t

00:49:15.731 –> 00:49:17.491
want it to be like that well Well, you know,

00:49:17.731 –> 00:49:23.591
to that end, it can be a heavy subject matter for some people, maybe more than others.

00:49:23.831 –> 00:49:27.971
So it’s easy to make that as simple and digestible as possible.

00:49:27.971 –> 00:49:33.611
So you don’t bog them down in the in the in the heaviness of it all, if you will.

00:49:34.611 –> 00:49:38.031
So that that’s great. Well, David, I appreciate you coming on.

00:49:38.151 –> 00:49:43.931
This has been a great talk and I’m excited to get it out there and see what the reaction is.

00:49:44.911 –> 00:49:49.231
No, thank you. I enjoyed it. I appreciate you having me. Yes,

00:49:49.371 –> 00:49:51.231
sir. We’ll talk to you soon. Thanks so much.

00:49:52.080 –> 00:50:12.477
Music.